[House Hearing, 115 Congress]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]
DEVELOPMENT, DIPLOMACY, AND DEFENSE: PROMOTING U.S. INTERESTS IN AFRICA
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HEARING
BEFORE THE
COMMITTEE ON FOREIGN AFFAIRS
HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
ONE HUNDRED FIFTEENTH CONGRESS
SECOND SESSION
__________
DECEMBER 12, 2018
__________
Serial No. 115-176
__________
Printed for the use of the Committee on Foreign Affairs
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COMMITTEE ON FOREIGN AFFAIRS
EDWARD R. ROYCE, California, Chairman
CHRISTOPHER H. SMITH, New Jersey ELIOT L. ENGEL, New York
ILEANA ROS-LEHTINEN, Florida BRAD SHERMAN, California
DANA ROHRABACHER, California GREGORY W. MEEKS, New York
STEVE CHABOT, Ohio ALBIO SIRES, New Jersey
JOE WILSON, South Carolina GERALD E. CONNOLLY, Virginia
MICHAEL T. McCAUL, Texas THEODORE E. DEUTCH, Florida
TED POE, Texas KAREN BASS, California
DARRELL E. ISSA, California WILLIAM R. KEATING, Massachusetts
TOM MARINO, Pennsylvania DAVID N. CICILLINE, Rhode Island
MO BROOKS, Alabama AMI BERA, California
PAUL COOK, California LOIS FRANKEL, Florida
SCOTT PERRY, Pennsylvania TULSI GABBARD, Hawaii
RON DeSANTIS, Florida [until 9/10/ JOAQUIN CASTRO, Texas
18] deg. ROBIN L. KELLY, Illinois
MARK MEADOWS, North Carolina BRENDAN F. BOYLE, Pennsylvania
TED S. YOHO, Florida DINA TITUS, Nevada
ADAM KINZINGER, Illinois NORMA J. TORRES, California
LEE M. ZELDIN, New York BRADLEY SCOTT SCHNEIDER, Illinois
DANIEL M. DONOVAN, Jr., New York THOMAS R. SUOZZI, New York
F. JAMES SENSENBRENNER, Jr., ADRIANO ESPAILLAT, New York
Wisconsin TED LIEU, California
ANN WAGNER, Missouri
BRIAN J. MAST, Florida
FRANCIS ROONEY, Florida
BRIAN K. FITZPATRICK, Pennsylvania
THOMAS A. GARRETT, Jr., Virginia
JOHN R. CURTIS, Utah
VACANT
Amy Porter, Chief of Staff Thomas Sheehy, Staff Director
Jason Steinbaum, Democratic Staff Director
C O N T E N T S
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Page
WITNESSES
The Honorable Tibor P. Nagy, Jr., Assistant Secretary, Bureau of
African Affairs, U.S. Department of State...................... 4
Mr. Ramsey Day, Senior Deputy Assistant Administrator, Bureau for
Africa, U.S. Agency for International Development.............. 16
LETTERS, STATEMENTS, ETC., SUBMITTED FOR THE HEARING
The Honorable Tibor P. Nagy, Jr.: Prepared statement............. 8
Mr. Ramsey Day: Prepared statement............................... 18
APPENDIX
Hearing notice................................................... 56
Hearing minutes.................................................. 57
The Honorable David Cicilline, a Representative in Congress from
the State of Rhode Island: Material submitted for the record... 59
DEVELOPMENT, DIPLOMACY, AND DEFENSE: PROMOTING U.S. INTERESTS IN AFRICA
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WEDNESDAY, DECEMBER 12, 2018
House of Representatives,
Committee on Foreign Affairs,
Washington, DC.
The committee met, pursuant to notice, at 10:00 a.m., in
room 2172 Rayburn House Office Building, Hon. Edward Royce
(chairman of the committee) presiding.
Mr. Royce. This hearing will come to order. This hearing is
on Development, Diplomacy, and Defense: Promoting U.S.
Interests in Africa, and today we will hear from the
administration on U.S. policy toward Africa. This is
particularly timely as tomorrow the administration will roll
out a new Africa strategy.
There is longstanding bipartisan consensus in Congress that
the U.S. must be fully engaged on the continent of Africa. U.S.
diplomacy and assistance saves lives. It increases our
security. It builds capacity. It advances conservation. It
spurs economic opportunity for both Americans and Africans.
Africa is a continent of immense opportunity and challenge,
blessed with tremendous resources, newly empowered consumers,
entrepreneurial youth. In many places, this means significant
potential for U.S. companies to increase their trade and
investment. In other areas, however, despotic leaders continue
to exploit power and pilfer resources for personal gain,
ignoring pressing social and economic needs.
Meanwhile, unfortunately, in some parts of Africa,
terrorists and transnational criminal organizations have found
safe haven in vast, ungoverned spaces. This committee has been
at the forefront in responding to these opportunities and
challenges. Landmark legislation like the Africa Growth and
Opportunity Act and Electrify Africa have energized U.S.
economic engagement on the continent, and more recently the
President signed into law the BUILD Act which increases our
ability to support private sector investment.
These and other initiatives are helping the next generation
of entrepreneurs and civil society leaders to create jobs in
their communities and demand more accountability from their
governments. Improved health, thanks in large part to programs
like PEPFAR and the Global Food Security Act, means Africans
are living longer and healthier lives.
The committee has also been a leader in efforts to crack
down on poaching and illicit trafficking so that elephants and
rhinos and magnificent natural resources are preserved and
local communities there benefit rather than be plundered by
criminal and terrorist organizations. In tackling these
challenges, we shouldn't engage with only the countries who are
our friends. Our interests are diverse and continent-wide. We
simply must work in the toughest places to defend these
interests.
And we know what happens when the U.S. fails to engage. We
know who fills that void, it is China and Russia. They already
are by ramping up business investment, access to finance, arms
sales, and military partnerships. Several of us on the
committee have seen this firsthand. Last year, China opened its
first permanent military base co-located with the U.S. base in
Djibouti. We must get this right. Our diplomatic, economic, and
national security interests are at stake.
We must deploy adequate resources to support our interests
in Africa. We must continue to not back away from building
partner capacity, to improve security, to foster trade, to
foster economic development, strengthen health systems, combat
wildlife trafficking, and support good governance. We must be
steadfast in our support of the men and women, Americans and
Africans, working to advance democracy, stability, peace, to
ultimately create better lives. That is the foundation of an
effective Africa strategy.
And I would like to thank Ranking Member Eliot Engel, as
well as Chairman Chris Smith, and Ranking Member Karen Bass of
the Africa Subcommittee for their dedication to these issues.
This is my last hearing as chairman of this committee. It has
been the honor of a lifetime to work with my colleagues to
strengthen our country and advance neoliberal values worldwide.
I am forever grateful to your support.
And, lastly, I want to thank Staff Director Tom Sheehy and
Chief of Staff Amy Porter who are leaving the committee. They
have been essential to our many successes. I now turn to the
ranking member, Mr. Eliot Engel.
Mr. Engel. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you for calling
this hearing. As you mentioned, I am guessing this will be the
final hearing of the Foreign Affairs Committee of the 115th
Congress and, Mr. Chairman, your final hearing as chairman. And
so, this is a fitting subject to focus on, because there is not
a member of this body who has done more than you when it comes
to American engagement across the African continent.
Legislation to expand access to reliable electricity, to
provide better sources of food and nutrition, to crack down on
wildlife trafficking and the criminal networks responsible for
it, to help foster growth and development and stability. Bill
after bill after bill passed through this committee and the
Congress are now law, thanks to the leadership and vision of
Chairman Ed Royce.
And the committee's work on Africa has looked like the vast
majority of the work this committee has done under Ed's
chairmanship. It has been thoughtful, it has been bipartisan,
it has reflected the commitment of this committee's members to
push legislation that advances American interests and values
leaving politics aside.
So, Ed, let me just thank you for the way you have run this
committee. If I am elected chairman by the Democratic caucus it
is my full intention to handle things with the same sort of
fairness and collegiality that you have. So I want to thank you
for everything you have done. Thank you for being our
colleague, thank you for being our friend. And we have made the
lives of countless people better because of your hard efforts.
We always say that the Foreign Affairs Committee is the
most bipartisan committee in Congress and we always say that
partisanship should stop at the water's edge. And that is what
you and I have tried to do and it has been a pleasure working
next to you and working with you. Thank you.
Mr. Royce. Thank you.
Mr. Engel. Turning to today's hearing, I want to welcome
our witnesses. It has been rare in the last few years that we
have had administration officials before the committee, so we
hope this begins a new trend. So we are glad to see you.
We have seen a number of promising developments in Africa
lately. In Senegal, a new Millennium Challenge Corporation
compact worth more than $.5 billion will help meet the growing
demand for reliable electricity in one of Africa's fastest-
growing economies. In Ethiopia, after months of protests in a
violent, destabilizing crackdown, the Prime Minister committed
to reform has risen to power. We need to help sustain the
momentum of the country's positive trajectory.
Nigeria's elections, planned for February of next year,
will be massively consequential. The progress Nigeria has made
demonstrates the importance of continued American support for
Nigeria's Independent National Electoral Commission and other
organizations like it.
At the same time, we are keeping an eye on some seriously
troubling trends when it comes to human rights: In Uganda, the
arrest and torture of opposition politicians even as that
country receives massive American counterterrorism assistance;
in Tanzania, crackdowns on free speech and press along with
threats to the LGBTQ community; Cameroon's longtime leader just
elected to a seventh term continues to cling to power in the
face of a growing insurgency; and Zimbabwe, where July's
elections were marred by fraud and intimidation and where the
government has shown little interest in enacting desperately
needed reforms.
So there are plenty of areas that demand our continued
focus and I think that we need to work hard to make sure that
these things are taken care of. After the Nigerian army
massacred 40 unarmed civilians, they tweeted a clip of the
President suggesting our own military use lethal force against
asylum seekers on our southern border.
In August, the President tweeted a white nationalist
conspiracy theory that offended our partners in South Africa, a
country to which he has nominated an Ambassador. And in
January, the President referred to African countries in general
using a term that I won't repeat here. So these words send a
troubling message, but our country's actions are even more
important and that is why I am opposed to the administration's
trying to slash funding for global health efforts.
The ongoing Ebola outbreak in the DRC's North Kivu province
is the second largest in history and the region is so unstable
that we have had to withdraw CDC personnel from the area. This
crisis underscores why strong funding for global health is so
critical. We want countries to be able to stop epidemics
quickly and effectively, hopefully before they start and
definitely before they reach our shores. So we can't go along
with fewer resources and it troubles me that the administration
seems to be pushing in that direction.
And, broadly speaking, we should not have a foreign policy
of withdrawal and isolation because we leave a void that our
adversaries are only too happy to fill. Africa is a prime
example. If we fail to stay engaged, there is no doubt that
China and Russia will swoop in and exert influence. In my view,
we simply cannot let that happen. So I am eager to hear from
our witnesses about how we are going to advance American
interests and values in this critical region.
Mr. Chairman, I thank you again and I want to point out the
wonderful work that Karen Bass and Chris Smith have done in
order to get to the point where we are really making a
difference in people's lives. So thank you again, I yield back.
Mr. Royce. Thank you very much, Mr. Engel. I appreciate it,
Eliot.
So this morning I am pleased to welcome the Honorable Tibor
Nagy, Jr. and Mr. Ramsey Day to the committee. Ambassador Tibor
Nagy currently serves as Assistant Secretary of State for
African Affairs. Prior to his appointment, he served as U.S.
Ambassador to Ethiopia, Ambassador to Guinea, and as the Deputy
Chief of Mission in Nigeria. In total, Ambassador Nagy has 20
years of experience working across Africa.
Ramsey Day is with us, currently serving as the Senior
Deputy Assistant Administrator for Africa at USAID. Previously,
Mr. Day was the Senior Director for the Center for Global
Impact at the International Republican Institute. He has held
numerous positions within the international development and
foreign policy communities both in the United States and
various overseas posts.
And so we appreciate you both being with us today. Without
objection, the witnesses' full prepared statements will be made
part of the record. Members will have 5 calendar days to submit
any statements or questions or extraneous material for the
record.
Before proceeding, I would like to take a moment and
recognize in the audience Florie Liser of the Corporate Council
on Africa for her steadfast leadership to increase trade and
investment in Africa; Troy Fitrell, who worked as a fellow on
this committee, is just back from serving as Deputy Chief of
Mission in Addis Ababa, in Addis; Kathleen Moody of the State
Department who has been working on African issues for as long
as I have; Tony Carroll who is with us, former Peace Corps, who
has testified in front of this committee before on Africa.
So, and we see many other old African hands in the audience
as well, so it is great to have you with us here in the
audience. And so, Ambassador Nagy, I would ask you, please
summarize your remarks. Thank you.
STATEMENT OF THE HONORABLE TIBOR P. NAGY, JR., ASSISTANT
SECRETARY, BUREAU OF AFRICAN AFFAIRS, U.S. DEPARTMENT OF STATE
Ambassador Nagy. Thank you, Chairman Royce, Ranking Member
Engel, members of the committee for the opportunity to testify
today on U.S. policy toward Africa, and to my colleague and
friend, Ramsey Day of USAID, here with me today. I also want to
express my gratitude and on behalf of the Africa Bureau at the
State Department to Chairman Royce for his decades of service
to Africa, Africa relations, and other members for your
longstanding interest in Africa.
Today's hearing comes at an opportune time. We are at a
critical juncture for the relationship between the United
States and the nations and people of Africa. Africa faces an
uncertain and challenging, but by no means predetermined
future. The choices we make now will affect not only our
relationship with the continent but will have ramifications
worldwide.
Africa is facing a demographic tsunami. Its population will
double by 2050 to around 2.5 billion people, 50 percent of whom
will be under the age of 24. Challenges with infrastructure,
corruption, and terrorism continue, and China is asserting
itself on the continent economically, militarily, and
politically.
We must remain a positive alternative and make clear that
engaging with the United States will mean greater prosperity
and security for Africa. I am very fortunate to be in my
current position. Virtually, my entire career centered on
Africa, much of it living there in eight different countries.
Since my first diplomatic assignment 40 years ago, Africa
has changed dramatically. I recently concluded two trips to the
continent in West Africa and East Africa where I also addressed
the African Union. Let me assure you of this, our potential
with Africa is limitless. With every challenge there is
opportunity and we must capitalize on our successes.
Here, I would like to articulate some of the focus areas of
the Bureau of African Affairs. First, we are promoting stronger
trade and commercial ties between the United States and Africa,
working with our African partners to build a level playing
field across the continent's markets. African governments need
to increase transparency and fairness in their commercial
environments to attract more business and have predictable
policies, laws conforming to international standards, and a
credible dispute resolution process.
Second, more than 60 percent of sub-Saharan Africa or 600
million people is below the age of 25, representing 40 percent
of sub-Saharan Africa's unemployed. We are working to match
American investment and ingenuity with a dynamism and
entrepreneurial spirit of young Africans, anchoring them to
their countries and keeping them from resorting to migration,
militancy, or crime.
The third area is working to advance peace and security
through partnerships with African governments and effective
regional mechanisms. Finally, we are focused on countering the
Chinese narrative and setting the record straight. The United
States has a longstanding commitment to Africa as a partner
positively supporting economic growth, good governance, rule of
law, enhance gender equality and the health of the African
people.
Let me begin with the promotion of stronger trade and
investment ties. Everywhere I speak to an African audience I
emphasize we seek to do business not just in Africa but with
Africa. Our promotion of free trade agreements with the United
States communicates to Africans that transparency, fairness,
and good governance attract U.S. investment and we hope to
negotiate a first-ever free trade agreement with a sub-Saharan
country.
Trade has greatly expanded. Under the African Growth and
Opportunity Act, from 2000 to 2016, U.S. investment in sub-
Saharan Africa increased from $7 billion to $29 billion,
providing opportunities for hundreds of thousands of Africans.
Since 2000, U.S. exports to Africa rose from 6 to more than
$14 billion last year, and U.S. imports from Africa total
nearly $25 billion. The total two-way trade of $39 billion in
2017, up 5.8 percent from 2015. The U.S. Millennium Challenge
Corporation provides assistance to the world's poorest
countries who demonstrate commitment to good governance,
economic freedom, and investing in their citizens.
This week I attended a ceremony with Secretary Pompeo where
MCC and the Government of Senegal signed a $550 million compact
that will modernize Senegal's power sector to increase economic
growth and reduce poverty through improved access to
electricity. The BUILD Act, and thank you very much to Congress
for the BUILD Act which President Trump signed into law in
October with strong bipartisan support, will establish the U.S.
International Development Finance Corporation. This new law
consolidates, modernizes, and reforms the U.S. Government's
development finance capabilities.
Africa is the largest regional exposure totaling more than
$6 billion and the BUILD Act will help mobilize additional
private sector investment. With our second focus, we go beyond
investing in Africa to invest in Africans. Through the Young
African Leaders Initiative or YALI, we equip the next
generation of Africans with leadership and entrepreneurship
skills. The YALI network, a virtual community of more than .5
million members, helps young Africans develop skills and
connections needed to make change in their communities.
Our third focus, promoting peace and security, is essential
to secure Africa's opportunities and prosperity. We support
African-led efforts against terrorism and other transnational
threats. U.S. assistance has brought some success in the Lake
Chad region, Somalia, and elsewhere. And we seek burden-sharing
opportunities with non-African actors as well.
We have provided training to peacekeepers from more than 20
African countries with substantial impact. Ten years ago,
Africans comprised only 40 percent of the continent's
peacekeepers. Now that figure has exceeded 60 percent. U.S.-
funded programming is vital to these forces as it is to the G5
Sahel Joint Force and African-driven efforts in the Lake Chad
region to counter terrorism in West Africa.
Our African partners are working to ensure stability and
defeat terrorist organizations in East Africa as well. The
AMISOM mission composed of regional states is helping Somalia
become more stable and prosperous and we are providing
development and security assistance to the Somalis to govern
themselves. Additionally, we support efforts by African
partners to strengthen their maritime and border security and
their efforts to address trafficking in arms, drugs, and
wildlife.
Finally, we want to be clear to all Africans that the
United States has an unwavering commitment to the continent
shown through our longstanding partnerships and support for
good governance, security, human rights and economic growth,
and provision of humanitarian assistance. African countries
should know that some infrastructure projects and seemingly
attractive loan terms from other countries can lead down a
dangerous path to indebtedness, loan defaults, and
concessionary extraction of natural resources stifling the
economic growth needed to create jobs.
In contrast, the United States is pursuing sustainable
alternatives for African growth and development. U.S. programs
like AGOA, PEPFAR, Power Africa, and Feed the Future opened the
U.S. market to African goods, countered HIV/AIDS, brought
electricity to rural areas, protected vulnerable women and
children, supported youth entrepreneurship, and helped Africans
in innumerable ways.
As we continue to engage with Africa we must assess how to
best work with each country and multilateral institution to
advance our mutual interest and priorities. The State
Department cannot do this alone. We need to continually
synchronize our approach among all elements of national power.
Only by balancing resources among development, diplomacy, and
defense can we speak with a coordinated voice to the
governments and the people of Africa.
I do not exaggerate when I say Africa is the continent of
the future, but a future envisioned by Africans and not one
seen as forced upon them, and success must ultimately come from
developing African solutions to African problems. We must look
at Africa through the windshield not through the rearview
mirror.
Thank you for the opportunity to speak today. I look
forward to your support as our nation continues our engagement
with Africa.
[The prepared statement of Ambassador Nagy follows:]
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Mr. Royce. Thank you, Ambassador.
Mr. Day? And feel free, Mr. Day, to just summarize those
remarks. Try to keep to 5 minutes.
STATEMENT OF MR. RAMSEY DAY, SENIOR DEPUTY ASSISTANT
ADMINISTRATOR, BUREAU FOR AFRICA, U.S. AGENCY FOR INTERNATIONAL
DEVELOPMENT
Mr. Day. Thank you, Chairman.
Mr. Royce. Thank you, sir.
Mr. Day. Chairman Royce, Ranking Member Engel, members of
the committee, I am grateful for the opportunity to testify
before you today. I would like to extend a special thank you to
the committee and your colleagues in Congress whose longtime
bipartisan commitment to the peoples of the African continent
provides the foundation for USAID programs and the springboard
for their success.
And while challenges remain, I truly believe that Africa's
future is bright. The investments and commitment of the
American people to the people of Africa are paying off and
USAID has set its priorities to capitalize on the region's
emerging opportunities. Under Administrator Green's leadership,
USAID is focusing its resources in places where the conditions
are right to establish and sustain progress.
U.S. assistance in Africa certainly saves lives and it also
spurs trade and investment and advances peace and security.
Take the President's Emergency Plan for AIDS Relief or PEPFAR,
this program is a powerful expression of the compassion and
generosity of the American people. In 2016, a PEPFAR assessment
showed the first evidence of the epidemic becoming controlled
in three key African countries--Malawi, Zambia, and Zimbabwe.
These same countries have reduced the new HIV infections by
as much as 75 percent since the start of the PEPFAR program.
And with continued focus, the U.S. Government is poised to help
control the HIV epidemic in ten African countries over the next
4 years. The United States is also the world's leading
humanitarian donor. USAID provides humanitarian assistance
across the continent including in Nigeria, South Sudan, and
Somalia where conflict and instability are fueling food
insecurity and displacement.
USAID experts have also been deployed to the Democratic
Republic of Congo or DRC to help respond to the current Ebola
crisis. But even as USAID mobilizes the best of American
generosity, we also work to prepare for future shocks and equip
countries with the tools they will need to feed themselves.
USAID is also highly focused on the immense trade and
international investment opportunities, which we believe is the
fastest way for Africa to boost its economic growth, which is
in the interest of the United States. We believe that African
nations can tap the trillions of dollars in private sector
resources needed to advance the continent's development and
ultimately eliminate the need for unsustainable foreign-backed
loans.
One area where we are using a market approach or private
sector engagement is the power sector, an area where we greatly
appreciate Chairman Royce's leadership with the enactment of
the Electrify Africa Act. Power Africa, a whole of government
effort led by USAID, employs a partnership approach to engage
U.S. Government agencies, international donors and finance
institutions, host country counterparts, and of course the
private sector. Power Africa has helped add over 12.5 million
new electrical connections, which means more than 57 million
people have access to electricity who did not have access prior
to the initiative's launch.
USAID Trade and Investment Hubs in Africa are helping to
transform African economies and deepen the U.S.-Africa trade
and investment relationship. They reduce regional trade
barriers and promote trade and investment under the Africa
Growth and Opportunity Act or AGOA, legislation that this
committee championed. The Trade and Investment Hubs have also
directly leveraged $1.3 billion in African exports under AGOA
and many of the jobs created are held by women who tend to
invest job-related income into their families and communities.
However, we can't talk about successful economic future for
African countries without addressing peace and security. USAID
works with our African partners to address the underlying
factors that allow transnational crime, violent extremism, and
internal conflict to flourish. Working in partnership with
African governments and civil society, our support strengthens
institutions; protects the democratic gains that have been made
all across the continent.
USAID is also combating the threat of wildlife trafficking
in countries across sub-Saharan Africa. USAID and its partners
are making it more difficult for people to poach, move, and
sell wildlife products across borders. This helps secure our
natural resources and fight the criminal networks that threaten
security and the rule of law and ultimately undermine
development progress.
Our focus is on helping countries on their journey to self-
reliance. USAID's goal is to end the need for foreign
assistance. As Administrator Green has said, it is our core
belief that each country must lead its own development journey.
We are focusing on ending the need for foreign assistance not
because we wish to retreat from our friends, but because we
believe in them.
If a country is willing to take on the difficult journey to
self-reliance, we want to walk alongside them along that
journey. At USAID, we are looking toward the day when the
transition to a new kind of relationships that move beyond
traditional assistance and enduring relationships, a
relationship in which countries move from recipients of aid to
partners to even fellow donors.
And on a personal note, I am truly honored to be here
today. I am deeply committed to USAID's goals and the
integrated role that USAID plays with the Department of State
as well as the Department of Defense in advancing U.S. policy
and national security objectives. So thank you for the
opportunity to be here and I look forward to your questions.
[The prepared statement of Mr. Day follows:]
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Mr. Royce. Thank you, Mr. Day.
Let me bring up some testimony last December. Deputy
Secretary Sullivan and Department of Defense Under Secretary
Trachtenberg testified that as terrorist groups are facing
defeats in the Middle East, we are seeing activity increase and
expand elsewhere, including and especially in Africa.
So we know that terrorist groups benefit from poor
governance and instability, which is present in parts of
Africa, and we know that terrorists abroad pose a direct threat
to U.S. interests even here at home. The State Department leads
on our counterterrorism efforts through train and equip
authority and other law enforcement capacity programs. The
committees work to ensure that this remains the case.
And I know it has been reported that the administration
intends to shift to combating great power competition in Africa
and shift away from the robust counterterrorism engagement that
we have had our eye on here, and I wanted to ask you,
Ambassador, how will this shift in priorities impact our
progress toward building the capacity of partner nations in
Africa to counter these dangerous security threats themselves?
Ambassador Nagy. Thank you very much, Chairman. During my
last two trips to the continent just concluded a couple of days
ago, that is one of the questions and one of the issues that I
looked into extensively both in discussions with the host
government, also I stopped off both in London and Paris to
discuss with some of our allies some of those considerations.
And this time I was with AFRICOM Commander General Waldhauser
both in Ethiopia and then I stopped off in Stuttgart to have
extensive discussions there and I also visited Camp Lemonnier
in Djibouti again to discuss that various issue.
And while I have to leave any details and specifics to the
Department of Defense, I just want to assure you that that is
at the top of our list in discussions to make sure that we
continue to move forward with the counterterrorism, because as
you say it is extremely problematic. Also during my time in
West Africa, I had held discussions with the Prime Minister of
Togo and with the President of Guinea, and both the Guineans
and the Togolese now are concerned over the terrorism seeping
into their own countries from the previous area in the Sahel.
So I assure you that issue is very much front and center
and we are going to continue focusing on it and coordinating
with our friends at AFRICOM.
Mr. Royce. I understand. But I reached out to the
Department of Defense and they are not here today and so it
falls on you----
Ambassador Nagy. Yeah.
Mr. Royce [continuing]. To convey to us the intentions
here, because this committee is going to continue to have a
focus on exactly this issue.
But I will ask both of you, we have got to engage with
countries across Africa even the most challenging countries
with which we have significant differences. Too many policy
priorities, frankly, depend on it. You know better than we do
just how true this is, just as we are dealing now in Congo with
the Ebola crisis in the East.
So if we were take an example of wildlife trafficking, we
have a tenuous relationship with a number of East and Central
African countries yet we support their park rangers. We support
their law enforcement agencies to combat poaching and
trafficking. We try to enforce the bill we passed here to
abolish the ivory trade, right.
So if we shift away from working with challenging nations
what happens to these partnerships? I would like to hear you
articulate, Ambassador, and Mr. Day as well, what is the intent
here? I haven't seen the plan rolled out yet so I would like to
hear your thoughts on this.
Ambassador Nagy. Exactly, Chairman. The partnerships in
those critical areas will certainly go on. We have both a
bilateral strategy and we will continue our discussions with
AFRICOM with a region-wide strategy.
During my visit to Stuttgart, we discussed some of these
very issues both for the Sahel, for Lake Chad, for East Africa,
Somalia, for Djibouti, and then also especially for providing
for the safety and security of U.S. personnel and properties
throughout Africa.
So again I can't give you any specifics, but I can assure
you that that is an ongoing discussion. We had a general
meeting here with AFRICOM several weeks ago. I met with the
entire AFRICOM staff when I was in Stuttgart, had the same
discussions in Djibouti at Camp Lemonnier, so that goes on.
Mr. Royce. My time has expired, so we will follow up----
Ambassador Nagy. Absolutely.
Mr. Royce [continuing]. Afterwards with you.
Karen Bass of California.
Ms. Bass. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Let me just
begin by saying that, one, I want to join in with my colleagues
to thank you for your leadership and say that it is
particularly meaningful that you chose your last hearing to be
on this region of the world.
And I just wanted to take note of that and to let you know
that when I am in the community or in the press or whatever,
when they are always attacking us for never working on a
bipartisan basis, I always use this committee and I especially
talk about your leadership, as over these years you have always
led this committee in a bipartisan way and you will be missed.
But I will also put you on notice that you are from Southern
California, as am I, and so you might be retiring from Congress
but I don't intend to let you just retire. I will be calling on
you, in other words.
Mr. Royce. Thank you.
Ms. Bass. Let me fire off a series of questions and then
leave it to the two of you to respond. You mentioned,
Ambassador, about AGOA. And I appreciate you mentioning that
because a number of African countries are getting concerned
with a push toward free trade agreements that what does that
mean for AGOA and especially recognizing that some countries
might be ready but others aren't. And so what does the future
of AGOA hold?
In terms of elections coming up, we have DRC in just a
couple of weeks, we have Nigeria in February and want to know
what role we are playing and particularly concerned in DRC. And
you mentioned, Mr. Day, about Ebola and that we are there, but
it is my understanding that CDC is not allowed there and so
maybe you can respond to that.
So if you two could respond to both of those.
Ambassador Nagy. Thank you very much. I think on AGOA I
want to make it clear that AGOA goes on for another 5 years.
Ms. Bass. Right.
Ambassador Nagy. So we have that time to figure out how we
want to move beyond it because we do want to move beyond it. Up
to now, I didn't even know this until I came back to work in
the diplomatic side, we don't have any free trade agreements
with sub-Saharan Africa.
Ms. Bass. Right.
Ambassador Nagy. The only one we have on the African
continent is with Morocco.
Ms. Bass. Morocco, right.
Ambassador Nagy. Meanwhile, the Africa Union is heartily
pursuing the continent-wide free trade agreement----
Ms. Bass. Yes.
Ambassador Nagy [continuing]. Which we totally support. We
think that is a phenomenal idea and hopefully at some point we
can engage with them through that format. But right now, and
this is of special interest to me, we would like to identify,
start with one sub-Saharan country to explore a model free
trade agreement that we can then perhaps expand on with other
countries. We have had several, about a handful of countries
come to us and ask specifically to engage with them.
Ms. Bass. So let me--and I am sorry. I am going to have to
cut you off to make sure I can cover it all.
Ambassador Nagy. Sure.
Ms. Bass. In those 5 years we know that a lot of countries
are not even taking, aren't even able to utilize AGOA.
Ambassador Nagy. Exactly.
Ms. Bass. But we might think about a two-tiered approach
because for AGOA to just go away in 5 years doesn't seem to
make sense. But could you respond to the DRC.
Ambassador Nagy. Elections?
Ms. Bass. Yes.
Ambassador Nagy. Absolutely, okay. In Nigeria, when I
visited Nigeria I specifically looked at what we were doing on
the elections and I was so proud of Ambassador Symington and
his mission. They engaged with everybody. They sent everybody
everywhere. He had me meet with the National Electoral
Commission chair. He had me meet with the chairs of both
parties, ask them to sign a peace agreement. Last night
President Buhari and his party did sign a peace agreement.
Ms. Bass. Great. DRC?
Ambassador Nagy. DRC, 2 weeks to go, some major concerns
remain especially with the voting machines. They have 100,000
voting machines coming. We will see. They have a great
opportunity to have the first peaceful transition of power
since 1960.
Ms. Bass. And there is also some signaling that maybe the
elections are premature too, so coming from both sides which we
know that that is false, but just to flag that.
Ambassador Nagy. It is false. Hopefully, I see no reason
why they cannot go forward.
Ms. Bass. Ebola in DRC?
Mr. Day. On Ebola, thank you for the question,
Congresswoman. We are deeply concerned about the Ebola outbreak
in the DRC. This is the tenth outbreak. It is the largest we
have seen.
Ms. Bass. Is CDC allowed?
Mr. Day. The security environment in the immediate area of
Beni town is not permissible for U.S. Government employees, but
we do, USAID in partnership with CDC and WHO and the Ministry
of Health of the Government of DRC does have, we have
contractors on the ground and we are working in partnership.
Ms. Bass. So what are we doing specifically then? We are
providing what?
Mr. Day. So we are doing everything from disease
surveillance, case management, risk communications, ensuring
that information is getting out and getting out properly.
Ms. Bass. And you can let me know later who our partner is
that we have on the ground there?
Mr. Day. Of course.
Ms. Bass. Thank you.
Mr. Royce. Mr. Chris Smith of New Jersey.
Mr. Smith. Thank you very, very much, Mr. Chairman. And I
do want to join Eliot Engel and other members of the committee
in thanking you for your extraordinary leadership especially on
Africa. As former chairman of the committee, I thank you for
that leadership, but it continues to this moment. So thank you,
Ed, great job.
I want to welcome our two very distinguished witnesses,
thank them for their leadership as well, and Greg Simpkins, our
former staff director on the Subcommittee on Africa, Global
Health, Global Human Rights, and International Organizations
working over at USAID on behalf of the continent.
Let me just ask very quickly some questions. The festering
crisis in Cameroon, Ambassador Nagy, you had said that the last
thing we need is a growing radicalization in response to the
actions of security forces. You compared it to the response to
Boko Haram and how that actually caused it to worsen not get
better. You might want to please speak to that and what we are
doing to try to mitigate that danger.
Congratulations on the breakthrough with Ambassador
Yamamoto being deployed to Somalia. Your historic meeting in
Eritrea, which I think is just incredible, you might want to
comment on that briefly. And Karen Bass and I visited Ethiopia
and met with Prime Minister Abiy in Addis last August. We were
very impressed. We held a follow-up hearing about what we
thought were significant progress, release of prisoners and
all. Obviously there is so much more to be done. Please, if you
could spend a little time on that.
On the issue of China, we know that China is attacking the
dollar as the world's reserve currency and of course if that
goes our ability to hold countries to account is diminished, it
is lessened. Fourteen African countries met in Zimbabwe in
early spring talking about looking at the yuan as a potential
reserve currency.
A few months ago, African leaders met in Beijing and were
offered some $60 billion in financing, which shows--and we know
what they are after. They are after minerals. They are after
wood. They are after fossil fuels, and the spread of a bad
governance model under Xi Jinping who is cracking down in his
own country on Muslims.
I just had a hearing on the Uyghurs, the fact that 1
million people are now are in concentration camps in Xinjiang,
the autonomous region. Just the wrong country to be partnering
with African countries given the fact that their abuse of human
rights almost has no, maybe North Korea has very parallels
anywhere in the world. So if you could speak to this Chinese
influence, I know there is not much time, but on those issues.
And on Chemonics, we did have a hearing and the
subcommittee and the full committee has been on oversight on
the lateness of ARVs, you know, if you are late that could be a
death sentence. Is that being rectified, Mr. Day?
But Ambassador?
Ambassador Nagy. Thank you, sir. I will make this as quick
as possible. On Cameroon, not much improvement. We were hoping
that after the election of President Biya he would make some
moves to open up some dialogue with the Anglophone provinces,
he has not. Extremely disappointing, the problem goes on. We
continue to engage, but right now unfortunately not much
optimism, just pessimism.
On Isaias, absolutely. I spent 2 hours with the President,
extremely interesting points of view on the region. I hope that
it leads to further discussion because of course we continue to
have our bilateral problems with Eritrea and hopefully we can
resolve them in the future going forward, but Eritrea is one of
the key participants in the region and thanks to Prime Minister
Abiy for opening up that political space.
Yes, sir, your views on Ethiopian Prime Minister are right
on. I had a chance to engage with him as well. He is continuing
to move forward energetically not getting much sleep at night,
so let's hope for the best with him on both his external and
his internal changes.
On China, very interesting. I engaged about China with all
of my contacts and with the business communities at all of my
stops. I do have to say that I think the bloom is finally
starting to wear off as countries realize that China represents
a lot of debt, not much employment created, and not necessarily
the types of companies and business environments that they
want, especially the young people. I think if the United States
can capture the young people, I will leave the venal autocracy
to the Chinese and I will stop there.
Mr. Day. Thank you, Congressman. On the program that you
are referencing, the Global Health Supply Chain, I will get the
latest status on--I know there was a report that was released
last month, but I would like to say that we certainly
appreciate the oversight role that the committee plays and we
are absolutely committed to ensuring the highest standards of
accountability. But I will get a status on the report.
Mr. Smith. Finally, I just want to thank the President.
Yesterday, he signed into law a 5-year reauthorization of
PEPFAR. And, obviously, I was here with many of us who were
here when George W. Bush and our former chairmen, Henry Hyde
and Tom Lantos, led the effort for what is now, in my opinion,
the most successful global health initiative ever, anywhere in
the world.
It has ended largely the pandemic, 16 million to 17 million
people's lives have been saved, 2 million kids have been born
without HIV/AIDS, which they probably would have gotten as they
were being born through mother to child transmission. So
congratulations on that signing yesterday and thank you and I
yield back.
Mr. Royce. Mr. Brad Sherman of California.
Mr. Sherman. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. It has been an honor
to serve with you and I want to join the praise from the entire
chorus here.
And, Ambassador, I am thrilled to see you here, not out of
personal respect, although I certainly have personal respect
for you, but an administration witness who is actually
confirmed and not holding the position temporarily, it has been
2 years since I remember that occurrence.
Uganda is one of the largest recipients of U.S. security
assistance. Bobi Wine is free but still has this charge held
over him. Has the United States made it clear to the government
and Museveni that we are watching how Bobi Wine is treated?
Ambassador Nagy. Absolutely. As a matter of fact, I met
with the Angolan Prime Minister on the margins of the United
Nations and underlined that fact and a number of other
concerns.
Mr. Sherman. You said the Angolan?
Ambassador Nagy. Pardon me? The Ugandan----
Mr. Sherman. Ugandan, okay.
Ambassador Nagy. Ugandan Prime Minister on the margins and
underlined that fact very strongly. We continue to do that with
our engagements. Unfortunately, President Museveni shows no
signs of thinking about a transition and unfortunately----
Mr. Sherman. I want to move on to Uganda to talk about the
North Korean contractors to their security forces. Obviously
the North Koreans don't bring a dedication to the rule of law
and conduct of military operations in a humane manner. The Wall
Street Journal did a major report on this just a few days ago
and says, in part, U.S. officials say that Trump administration
has been instructed to remain quiet on North Korean involvement
in Uganda over concern that speaking out would undercut the
image of an effective sanctions regime.
Have you been instructed to, or I will put this in the
positive, can you now speak out against and describe what the
North Koreans are doing in Uganda?
Ambassador Nagy. Absolutely, Congressman. Our instructions
are and it is always included in our points of engagement with
all governments in Africa to urge them to comply with all
Security Council resolutions to minimize----
Mr. Sherman. Is Uganda complying?
Ambassador Nagy. I cannot answer that technically. I can
get back to you on that. I don't want to give you the wrong
answer. I do know that we urge them at every opportunity----
Mr. Sherman. Given the importance of the North Korean
nuclear program how would that not be something you would
already have an opinion on? I know the chairman has already
answered the question for us, so I yield to him.
Ambassador Nagy. I don't want to say that they are
compliant right now if they are not, but I will double check
that and get back to you. But I can assure you that that is one
of our strongest points in every engagement with every African
government.
Mr. Sherman. China is using this debt trap. They have used
it in Sri Lanka where they offer and then say, well, you didn't
pay so we are taking this or that over. And these are sovereign
countries, so they could simply say no, we are not going to pay
and no, you are not going to take our port. The problem they
have is that American and other financial institutions would
regard that as a default.
I wonder if you could work with me and perhaps others on
this committee to establish an international financial order
where if you don't pay a China debt trap debt your FICO score
still remains at 800, that there is basically no harm, no foul.
What can we do to make it plain to the financial markets that
it is simply illegal for them to count against a country that
its failure to pay one of these debt trap debts to China?
Ambassador Nagy. I would look forward to further discussion
on that and see exactly what we could do, because that is the
last thing we also want to do is see these countries get into
that trap.
Mr. Sherman. And I assume the State Department could look
at individual deals, identify which ones constitute this debt
trap financing, and declare that those are particular debts
with the nonpayment of which should not be considered by any
financial institution doing business in the United States.
Finally, Human Rights Watch has reported that the
Government of Tanzania is shutting down basically everything
involving the LGBTQ community. What is our approach to protect
the community in Tanzania?
Ambassador Nagy. Our approach is to raise our extreme
concern with that, to engage with civil society every means
that we can possibly do that to protect them, because Tanzania
is closing political space everywhere.
Mr. Sherman. Thank you.
Mr. Royce. Mr. Rohrabacher of California.
Mr. Rohrabacher. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman, and
congratulations to you for making it through this difficult
assignment of being the chairman of this committee. And I know
I have made it a little more difficult myself for you at times,
but we certainly appreciate your effort and those of Eliot. You
have been a good team and done good things for America and the
world.
So let me just suggest that the job that our witnesses have
had to do has been equally difficult and that trying to balance
off stability with reform and progress in Africa has got to be
one of the most daunting tasks of any group of our
professionals that are out there in our Foreign Service. And I
would note that I am going to mention a couple of negative
things, but let me just say that that does not mean that I
don't also recognize the positive things.
I think one of the worst things that we have done in our
country in terms of Africa is when our government suggested to
Ethiopia that they could negate and they could just ignore the
arbitration of the fight between Ethiopia and Eritrea. That did
more to undermine peaceful solutions in Africa than anything I
have seen in my lifetime.
And the fact is that the peace between Ethiopia and Eritrea
seems to be something that came from within and not something
that we actually pushed on. In fact, the repression and the
corruption of the Ethiopian Government over the years was not
ended because we, the United States, pulled back from that
corrupt and repressive regime. Instead, it came from within
even when there were signs for all of us.
I don't think that--I would hope that we learn from that,
that we should really be supporting reformers as came to power
in Ethiopia via a people's movement. And the signs of
corruption were everywhere in Ethiopia before the current
government, before the current Abiy came forward and led his
people toward peace with Eritrea and actually reforms.
Let me note that for years I have been active in pressuring
Ethiopia to try to give back the property, especially the
property of Americans that was confiscated by the Ethiopian
Government. Now the chairman and I have a family in Orange
County which we represent, the Berhane family, who owned some
very important and valuable assets, property in Ethiopia, and
the Ethiopian Government in the past never gave it back and
that is because some people were profiting from that.
I think that we should have been much more aggressive on
that and I would hope the Ethiopian Government, the current
government, moves on this problem because we have an American
family whose property is not being returned. And that is wrong
and it should be a symbol to us that that Ethiopian Government
is not going to be, or it will be corrupt. We are going to
watch to see what happens there and other pieces of property.
And to the degree that we had OPIC even denied Ethiopia the
right to have OPIC funds until that and other issues were
resolved, I suggest we continue that but I would hope we can
discard that type. I would hope that we could discard all of
those pressures on Ethiopia and Eritrea and promote their peace
and progress rather than looking at their faults. But it is up
to them to give us the sign that they mean real reform.
I would, as I say what can we do? We just had some
reference to China and how that makes these countries
vulnerable and I want to add to that but what can we do that
would prevent corruption in these African countries? What can
we do to regulate our own bankers not to profit by taking money
that was earned by corruption in these African countries?
Ambassador Nagy. Thank you very much for that. In my view,
the best thing we can do is encourage civil society because
they are a great watchdog on government wrongdoing. You know,
sir, in many of these countries there has not been a tradition
of any kind of civil society, and governments, especially
corrupt governments, are scared to death of civil society. That
is why they often go after them and try to close the political
space exactly because they hold them accountable.
And also of course a free and vigorous press, because the
media tends to be a wonderful watchdog as well, and then a
level playing field so that other businesses besides the ones
from the large country in East Asia have an equal chance at
contracts and dispute resolution. Thank you, sir.
Mr. Royce. Greg Meeks, New York.
Mr. Meeks. Mr. Chairman, I want to join the chorus in
thanking you for your leadership as chairman of this committee
and the way that you have conducted yourself and I do think it
says a lot about this hearing being your last is to show your
continued focus on the continent. I have traveled with you
several times to the continent. I have seen firsthand and I was
so inspired by what you do on this committee I decided to take
your old office. [Laughter.]
Thank you, gentlemen, for being here. I actually just came
back from South Africa with Global Citizens and they had
pledges to raise for worldwide $7 billion as a result of what
they are doing to eradicate poverty by 2030 and moving quite
briskly in trying to get attention particularly to the
continent of Africa as to what we need to do.
Unfortunately, oftentimes or as just happened at this time
while I was in Africa I asked about U.S. involvement, U.S.
investment, U.S. trade, and they are saying that they don't see
enough of us and so they have to deal with the individuals that
seem to have interest. Oftentimes that has been China.
And so I know and I am, as you have indicated how Africa's
on track to have 25 percent of global population in just 30
years, I believe that leveraging the resources of the U.S.
Government to support greater private sector investments which
I think is key is a win-win. And so from your perspective,
especially with DFI's ability to make equity investments in
Africa, will it encourage U.S. financial investors such as
pension funds, because that is, you get everybody to scale up
their investments alongside the new DFI, putting it together,
working in a combination way to help our presence and make a
difference and have some real equity investments in Africa.
Ambassador Nagy. Thank you, sir, absolutely. I have found
so much enthusiasm amongst American businesses wanting to take
their money to Africa because they have so much money available
right now looking for a place. And at the same time, in all my
travels I found the African governments equally enthusiastic at
wanting to bring U.S. businesses because U.S. businesses offer
something totally different than what Chinese investors do.
That is why I really want to thank you all for the BUILD
Act, because I think it finally puts some arrows in our quiver
that we didn't have before because it offers, with its $60
billion plus the possibility of equity investment, it offers
opportunities that we have not had before. And I can tell you
that the U.S. business community in Africa is enthusiastic
about it and all of the African governments we engage with
really wanted to know more about it. So we are going to
energize our Embassies to be there to come up with bankable
projects and to engage directly. And I told the African
governments, I can push you as businesses, but they need to do
the pulling by putting in place environments that actually
welcome and are fair to you as businesses. Thank you, sir.
Mr. Meeks. And we need to work and continue that because I
know even if you look at the work of China doing in there, but
even in China, China looks at the U.S. businesses, at least the
Chinese they wouldn't want to work for our companies in China.
So I know what we can do a better job in Africa than what we
have.
And also I know that USAID created a partnership with NASP
which was very important to target infrastructure investments
in Africa and I know that some of my New York pension funds
have been involved including the New York State Common
Retirement and the New York City Employees Retirement Funds.
And I think this is a tremendous initiative that moves in the
right direction and we oftentimes before when we want to divest
from bad things, we want to make sure now we are investing in
that regard.
And so I am a big supporter of initiatives like NETA,
however, what my concern is and what I think that would give us
even greater more investments would be is the fact that there
is a lack of diversity and inclusion of small, women, and
minorities in development finance opportunities at USAID and
OPIC. So how can we do better, because I think that diversity
will help us more on the continent also in that regards.
Mr. Day. Thank you, Congressman. You are absolutely right.
We at USAID believe we are facing immense challenges of course
on the African continent and we truly believe that those
challenges cannot be addressed with USAID official development
assistance alone. The private sector is absolutely critical to
this. In fact, Administrator Green is actually rolling out a
USAID private sector engagement policy as we speak.
So this is something that is at the forefront of our vision
for how USAID is going to be engaging with our African partners
so we fully agree with your vision as well.
Mr. Meeks. I yield back. And I just look forward to working
with you because we have small, minority, and women owned
businesses that I know are very interested if we can work
together on that.
Mr. Chabot [presiding]. Thank you very much. The
gentleman's time has expired. I now recognize myself for 5
minutes and I would like to start off with, a couple of our
colleagues have already talked about, China. I know Mr. Sherman
did and I think Mr. Smith did as well.
But Ambassador Nagy, let me ask you this. If you were in a
room with a number of, let's say, African countries
specifically, but they could be from other parts of the world,
where they were really trying to decide whether it made sense
to take advantage of the loans and opportunities that China is
putting out there versus working with the United States or
other countries, banks, et cetera, what would you tell--and we
have already talked about some of this. But what would you tell
them to look out for with China versus why it makes sense to
work with the U.S. or the West?
Ambassador Nagy. Thank you very much for that question.
What I would tell them to look out for is, number one, are they
going to bring over every single employee above turning a
shovel from China instead of hiring locally? How much
technology and professional transfer will there be when the
project is done? How good is the quality of the work that will
be done? Will they also bring over shopkeepers who will open up
shops to service the company's employees who will then displace
African mom and shopkeepers?
And when everything is done how much debt will there be
left, and by the way what will the environmental impact be?
Will there also be wildlife trafficking? Maybe timber cutting
in addition to that. So I would urge them to look at the
entirety of the project and what will be the true benefits not
only to putting down that road but to the country at large.
Mr. Chabot. Thank you. And having seen and followed this
closely firsthand for quite a few years now, what do you if
they said, well, what do you think on these things will happen,
what would you expect? Could you answer those questions that
you just asked what is likely to happen?
Ambassador Nagy. Well, I think that there is, as I said, a
shift in perceptions of the type of projects that they provide.
I just have to tell you one of the things that really, really
irritated me during my trips to Africa is you go to an African
city and there is a stadium invariably built by the Chinese.
And then the people say to me, well, what have the
Americans--I said, well, what about the millions and millions
of people we keep alive because of PEPFAR, what about the
tremendous educational programs that we have done to educate
the young people. And as I mentioned before, the young people
in Africa really do get this. They want American companies.
They want the type of expertise Americans have. They want the
transfer.
So I am actually very encouraged by the future and I think
that this BUILD Act will now really give our businesses some
weapons to compete fairly.
Mr. Chabot. Thank you very much. Ms. Bass was asking a
question before about and you were talking about the bilateral
free trade agreements, because I know the administration,
bilateral agreements are more appealing than regional deals, I
understand that. I am basically a free trader and I will accept
both.
But getting back to the bilateral agreements in sub-Saharan
Africa, you were about to say, I think, what countries are we
kind of working with or thinking about and then she had a
limited amount of time so you never really got into that.
Ms. Bass. Thank you.
Mr. Chabot. What countries are we talking about?
Ambassador Nagy. Can I respectfully not mention them yet,
because we haven't really fully engaged on that yet. So we are
at the point of actually just looking at possibilities and I
would not like to offset progress before we can start.
Mr. Chabot. How many are we talking about?
Ambassador Nagy. At least four have come forward and then
there are a couple of others that we would like to look at on
our own.
Mr. Chabot. Okay. Thank you.
Ambassador Nagy. Thank you, sir.
Mr. Chabot. We mentioned, I think, briefly before Museveni
in Uganda too. My very first codel was back in 1997 and one of
the countries we visited was Uganda and I remember particularly
memorable because Lady Di happened to die while we were on that
version so I remember specifically when this was. And I
remember Museveni at that time was being talked about as the
new African leaders and he had been in office, what, 12 years
or so then, so he was getting a little long in the tooth at
that point.
Well, we are two decades later. And don't get me wrong, I
think compared with previous and obviously in Uganda what a
breath of fresh air. He has been there awhile now. Could you
comment on that without asking a specific question about?
Ambassador Nagy. Absolutely. I have to tell you, sir, that
actually Museveni was one of my early heroes because of his
willingness to engage on HIV/AIDS when others were not. And at
that time Uganda's ABC strategy was the world leader in
confronting HIV/AIDS and also he did quite a lot of empowering
women politically in Uganda.
Unfortunately that was decades ago and the decades go on
and at some point leaders have to consider political
transitions and right now there seems to be an awful lot of
focus on keeping in power instead of the future of Uganda.
Mr. Chabot. Thank you very much. My time has expired.
The gentleman from New Jersey, Mr. Sires, recognized for 5
minutes.
Mr. Sires. Thank you. First, I would like to thank the
chairman. He is not here, but 26 years of service always in a
bipartisan fashion in this committee and I just want to thank
him even though he is not here.
Mr. Ambassador, I sit here and I listen to all the things
that you have said, all the things that you are accomplishing,
and I can only imagine it must be a very difficult job for you
to do especially with the rhetoric coming out of the White
House when he calls shithole countries, he calls people from
Western Hemisphere criminals, sick, and everything else.
When you get off the plane how do you deal with that? I
mean do you ignore what the President says? I don't want to put
you on the spot, you don't have to answer if you don't want to.
But I have got to tell you, it has got to be very difficult for
you getting off a plane and trying to work these deals.
Ambassador Nagy. Congressman, I have to be absolutely
honest. I have never had a problem getting off the plane
because I engage and talk about the wonderful things that
America as a whole is doing and I also talk about Africa is one
of the leading nonpartisan issues of our day and programs,
involvement, engagement.
Mr. Sires. I mean we all know China's effort in Africa and
certainly in the Western Hemisphere. Basically it is the same
tactics, wouldn't you say so, what they are doing in the
Western Hemisphere in countries? I mean I just read an article
where in Panama, China bought a big piece of property and what
they are trying to do is build this warehouse to equal Amazon
and they want to be the Amazon of the Western Hemisphere. I
guess the tactics are the same and how do you coordinate
fighting this?
Ambassador Nagy. I have to admit, and this is one of the
things I told my African interlocutors is that up to now I have
not blamed them in dealing with China, because when there was a
knock on the door for an investor and they opened it and only
China was standing there that is who they had to deal with. I
want to make sure that the next time there is a knock on the
door that there is American investors standing there as well
and that we can present what is more attractive about dealing
with the United States of America. So I would like to be very
aggressive in pursuing that, sir.
Mr. Sires. And in terms of you are talking free trade, free
trade, free trade, and again the rhetoric out of the White
House seems to be let's look inward, not let's look outward. I
mean it is just, to me it is two and two don't really add to
four with this particular administration.
Ambassador Nagy. Well, I get a lot of support from the
White House on expanding the free trade agenda and on engaging
U.S. businesses in Africa, so I can tell you that is my
experience, sir.
Mr. Sires. All right. I won't put you on the spot anymore.
Thank you very much. I yield back.
Mr. Connolly. Would my friend yield?
Mr. Sires. Absolutely.
Mr. Connolly. I thank my friend.
Ambassador Nagy, I appreciate the diplomatic skill with
which you answered my friend from New Jersey, but that White
House support certainly doesn't extend to USAID programming in
Africa. I mean last year he cut it 37 percent in his budget and
this year he has cut it 33 percent. How do you explain that to
African nations when you travel? We don't mean it? We are
kidding? We are counting to Congress to restore it? Don't read
anything into it in terms of the value we put in the
relationship or Africa? And what does it mean in terms of the
void it creates vis-a-vis China that has fortyfold increased
its trade posture vis-a-vis Africa in the last 20 years.
Mr. Day?
Mr. Day. Thank you, Congressman. I would also echo
Assistant Secretary Nagy's comments in that every time I am on
the continent USAID and our officials are welcomed with open
arms. And that is, I think, a reflection of the seven decades--
--
Mr. Connolly. Mr. Day, excuse me. That really was not my
question. I have been to Africa too. I know USAID very well. I
helped write the last foreign aid bill passed by Congress in
1985. I have been around awhile. My question wasn't are you
welcome, my question was how do you explain the fact that the
administration you represent cut their budget 37 percent last
year and another 33 percent this year?
We didn't go along with it because we actually see the
primacy of the relationship and the fact that is the world's
fastest-growing market. But nonetheless, a statement of value
is being made to those African countries and I am asking you
how you handle that on the ground. I am repeating, I am
building on the question my friend Mr. Sires asked Ambassador
Nagy.
Mr. Day. Congressman, at USAID we are laser-focused on
ensuring that taxpayer investments on the African continent are
deployed in the most efficient and effective manner and to the
benefit of the American people and the African people as well.
Mr. Chabot. The gentleman's time has expired.
Mr. Connolly. Well, thank God, because I don't know what
that answer meant.
Mr. Chabot. I thought it was a great answer.
The gentleman from South Carolina.
Mr. Connolly. I bet you did.
Mr. Chabot. Mr. Wilson is recognized for 5 minutes.
Mr. Wilson. And thank you, Mr. Chabot. And I want to join
with everyone commending Chairman Royce for his service. It is
really an indication of our appreciation of his service, the
portrait which is hanging up front which indicates again what
an extraordinary person Ed and his wife Marie have been on
behalf of our country.
And, Ambassador, thank you for being here. Mr. Day, thank
you. I saw your background with the International Republican
Institute. I was a volunteer with IRI. I know what a difference
it makes promoting freedom and democracy around the world.
Also, your work now with USAID with Administrator Mark Green,
how incredible.
As we travel around the world it is so impressive to see
the signs as I saw in rural Afghanistan of a school that had
been built by USAID, to see the food supplies being provided to
the refugees in Sudan, to be present with Chairman Royce in
Tacloban, The Philippines, to see the recovery efforts for
persons from Super Typhoon. USAID makes such a difference and I
hope more American citizens find out how significant it is.
With that, Ambassador, this year has been very hopeful with
Ethiopia and Eritrea signing an agreement in September that
ended the 20-year conflict and reopened land crossings to allow
people and goods to move freely between the countries--a 20-
year war concluded. To what extent can the very positive
reforms implemented by Prime Minister Abiy Ahmed in Ethiopia
have toward assisting internal challenges in Eritrea?
Ambassador Nagy. Indeed, sir, the changes have been
incredible. In my 40 years of following Africa, I don't think I
have ever seen anything that positive. And I would like to
ensure you that the United States Government is engaged in a
whole of government response to figure out how best we can
support those openings both on the internal side with Prime
Minister Abiy opening political space for his own citizens, but
also on the external side as literally waves of peace wash over
the whole subregion.
And as Ethiopians like to say, they are renaming the Horn
of Africa to the Hope of Africa and in many respects that is a
true characterization. So we are sending teams to engage
directly with different components of the government and we
have been invited to engage with many sectors and institutions
in Ethiopia to help rebuild them in a noncorrupt, totally
different model. Thank you, sir.
Mr. Wilson. Well, again, your positive attitude just is
reflected by the hope of Africa. That is great. Additionally,
what are the prospects for reestablishing diplomatic relations
between Eritrea and the United States?
Ambassador Nagy. Sir, thank you for the question. As I
said, when I was in Eritrea my dream is to eventually for the
United States to have the same positive relations with Eritrea
that we have with Ethiopia now. We have started the first
steps. We will continue the steps and hopefully it will lead
there. We still have some outstanding bilateral issues, which
they very well know, but we will deal with them one at a time
and it is a very valuable country to have as a friend and we
look forward to that, sir.
Mr. Wilson. Well, again it has just been so hopeful to see
the developments in Ethiopia and now Eritrea too, hopefully.
Next, what is the extent of African-based terrorist groups,
what challenges do they have as a direct threat to the American
people?
Ambassador Nagy. Thank you, sir. The problems with those
terrorist groups are as they occupy space which is not occupied
by governments it gives them freedom of action. And they may
start off as local terrorist groups, but as we can see that
they can then develop into interregional and even
intercontinental types of terrorist groups especially once they
affiliate with global ISIS or al-Qaeda. So they present an
imminent and a long-term danger, sir.
Mr. Wilson. And we saw, sadly, the attack last night in
Strasbourg.
Ambassador Nagy. Exactly.
Mr. Wilson. So we need to be ever-vigilant. And with that,
what more can the United States working with our African
partners do to prevent the spread of extremist ideologies to
protect the people of Africa and around the world?
Ambassador Nagy. Sir, that involves what we are doing is
closely working with the African states with outside interested
parties such as France, the European Union, the United Kingdom,
African Union, and the United Nations, and with the various
U.N. peacekeeping forces, because they are an imminent threat,
sir.
Mr. Wilson. Well, again thank you for your efforts. And the
thought of having the agreements between Eritrea and Ethiopia,
which would have been unimaginable, have occurred so best
wishes for continued success. Thank you.
Mr. Chabot. Thank you. The gentleman's time has expired.
The gentleman from Rhode Island, Mr. Cicilline, is recognized
for 5 minutes.
Mr. Cicilline. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I too want to begin
by thanking outgoing Chairman Royce for his extraordinary
leadership of this committee and the bipartisanship which he
has always demonstrated. And I hope the letter that you sent to
us about your tenure as chairman you will make an official part
of the record, because I think it really recounts in a very
meaningful way the great work that has been done under your
leadership. And I just want to thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Mr. Chabot. Without objection, so ordered.
Mr. Cicilline. Thank you.
Thank you to our witnesses. Ambassador Nagy, I would like
to start with you. As I am sure you are aware, U.N.
peacekeeping missions are currently deployed in several
countries on the African continent including South Sudan, Mali,
Central African Republic, and the Democratic Republic of Congo
where they work to promote stability in conflict-torn
societies, protect civilians from violence, and facilitate
humanitarian assistance to communities in need as well as
monitoring human rights abuses and supporting the rule of law
and the creation of democratic institutions.
The U.N. successfully wound down two peacekeeping missions
in Liberia and Cote d'Ivoire just this year. The United States
has long supported U.N. peacekeeping operations as a cost
effective method of conflict mitigation that helps prevent
fragile states from collapsing, keeps civil wars from morphing
into unwieldy regional disputes, and creating the conditions
necessary for long-term, sustainable peace.
In fact, the GAO recently found that U.N. peacekeeping
missions are eight times more cost effective than a unilateral
U.S. military engagement. Yet, Secretary Pompeo recently made
some troubling assertions about U.N. peacekeeping missions
claiming that they drag on for decades and bring us no closer
to peace.
I would certainly welcome a clarification on the
Secretary's remarks. And, specifically, my first question is,
does the Trump administration, which has voted to renew the
mandates of 12 U.N. peacekeeping missions since it took office,
still find value in their work?
Ambassador Nagy. Thank you very much, Congressman. Yes,
absolutely. There are phenomenally effective U.N. peacekeeping
missions, then there are some others that may be less
effective. And I think that is the whole focus of the
administration is to evaluate each mission on its own terms to
see if it is accomplishing its tasks, or if it is not do the
tasks need to be realigned. For example, I would like to point
to the one in Mali.
In February, the Secretary General, the U.N. Secretary
General will be issuing a report specifically on how that
peacekeeping mission is achieving its mandate and will take a
look to see if it needs to be modified or adjusted or whatever
else needs to be done, because as you know, sir, Mali is in a
very critical situation and there are a number of other
peacekeeping missions like that.
So absolutely, I agree with you totally, even though we are
paying, I think, right now 28 percent of the total cost of
peacekeeping missions. Some are phenomenal.
Mr. Cicilline. At a fraction of the cost of what it would
be if it were a military engagement obviously.
Ambassador Nagy. Absolutely.
Mr. Cicilline. I hope you will share those strong
sentiments with Secretary of State Pompeo. Do you see, Mr.
Ambassador, any missions today that you think should close?
Ambassador Nagy. Not any today, sir.
Mr. Cicilline. Okay, thank you. As you are aware, the U.N.
peacekeeping mission to Liberia wound down this year after
nearly 15 years in that country. Would you characterize that
mission as a success and can you also tell us what assistance
the U.S. is currently providing bilaterally to continue the
progress and the momentum in Liberia?
Ambassador Nagy. I would consider that one a success,
absolutely, because I remember when it started under ECOWAS and
then it transgressed to the U.N. But I will turn that over to
my colleague from USAID for what we are doing to continue to
support the country.
Mr. Day. Sure. Thank you, Congressman. We of course have
had a tremendous partnership with the Liberian Government for a
number of years and we have a robust program based in Monrovia,
everything from humanitarian assistance to health to supporting
civil society, democratic governance. There are still
tremendous challenges of course. Extreme poverty is one of the
major issues that we are dealing with.
But we have a good partner in the Liberian Government and
the new President, President Weah, has been actively engaged
with USAID programs. And so where we have good partners and
good partnerships we feel like USAID programs are the most
successful, so we have a very good partnership with the
Government of Liberia.
Mr. Cicilline. And, finally, if I would ask both of you to
comment on the current status of our work in the Central
African Republic. I traveled there at a time when I think it
was sort of a very critical moment and either the progress
could continue or there could be a significant retreat of that.
And I know there has also been some new reporting that the
Russians have engaged in a significant way. So if you could
each share the current status of CAR.
Mr. Day. From the USAID perspective we are primarily
focused on health and humanitarian assistance for the people of
CAR.
Ambassador Nagy. From the diplomatic perspective we are
really, really encouraging the African Union to be hyper-
engaged in the peace process there, because the Russians are
looking at the Central African Republic as an opportunity and
they are very much trying to work into a parallel peace process
to put themselves forward. So we really are calling on the
African Union to be very engaged and to make sure that there is
only peace process to bring the country back, sir.
Mr. Cicilline. Thank you very much. I yield back, Mr.
Chairman.
Mr. Chabot. Thank you. The gentleman's time has expired.
It was noted earlier today it is the last Foreign Affairs
Committee meeting for a number of members of this committee and
one of those is Darrell Issa from California, who I would just
note for the record has been an extremely valuable and
thoughtful member of this committee for a long time and thank
him for his service as well. And the gentleman is recognized
for 5 minutes.
Mr. Issa. Thank you. That is very kind. It has been a quick
18 years, but I am leaving it with good people behind and this
committee, I am sure, will function next Congress in the same
bipartisan way it has for so many years.
I have got a bunch of questions and let me try to go
through them. The first one is an umbrella one. With EXIM Bank
currently not able to fully function, with good intention by
USAID and the funding you have, obviously USTDA could be
mentioned in that group and OPIC, all of it together in Africa,
if you had to say what is our effort worth and what is China's
effort worth in dollars and capability, how would you measure
those, our dollars and capability and their dollars and
capability, based on the effort they are placing and the money
they are putting in?
Mr. Day, you probably see it every day.
Mr. Day. Thank you, Congressman. I say that is an excellent
question. I think when we think about how USAID and the
Americans engage with our partners on the African continent
compared to other potentially----
Mr. Issa. No, and I want you to answer that. I fully buy
that we go in there giving. We go in there with a real effort
to develop countries and their own independence. We go in there
as a gift to the rest of the world for safety and security, and
perhaps the Chinese have a different intent.
I want people to understand for the record, if we are
looking at the size of the army, so to speak, the size of the
guns, the size of the programs coming in from just China, there
are players, Russia and so on, and their effort in dollars and
capacity regardless of our good intention and regardless of the
goodwill we have, what are you faced with, their efforts, your
efforts, and some of the results?
Mr. Day. From a cash perspective in terms of an infusion
into Africa, we are not on the same level with China. However,
the value, the superior value proposition----
Mr. Issa. Meaning we give more almost anywhere in the
world, but they put more into Africa in dollars.
Mr. Day. In cash dollars. However, the superior value
proposition of American innovation and American companies
investing and two-way trade between Africa and the U.S., I
don't think that is a comparison either. I would put my money
on America every day.
Mr. Issa. Well, and there is one follow-up question that I
have been keenly looking at for many months. The difference in
a country which goes to based on, if you will, the 20- or 30-
year cost of building out, and particularly Power Africa, if
they go out based on lowest initial cost, isn't it true that
China wins every time?
And if they go out based on what is going to happen over
the life of those loans and support and maintenance that in
fact many Western countries including the United States almost
always would be better choices. Is that a fair statement?
Mr. Day. I believe that is a fair statement.
Mr. Issa. So one of the questions I have because a lot of
what we do as America is to help people temporarily, but we
always use that term that if you teach someone how to fish they
will be fed for a lifetime. What are the winning programs in
Africa that you either have or want to have that are funded,
but you might want to have funded more to teach them how to
fish so that the decisions and the programs and the long-term
Power Africa are sustainable and go further? What is it that we
need to do?
Mr. Day. You are absolutely right. I think Power Africa is
probably the shining example of a successful program in Africa
that really catalyzes American investment. I certainly believe
that a whole of government effort to coordinate all of the
interagency resources to bring those to bear to actually go to
our African partners and demonstrate the superior value
proposition that the U.S. has I think would be well received.
Mr. Issa. Okay. One last question, if I may. I was at the
change of current leaders in Zimbabwe some time ago. It is one
of those things you only get to do every 36 years or so. We,
the United States Government, are currently keeping out of
Zimbabwe, either a little bit here and maybe more for the
record.
What is it that you could accomplish if you were allowed to
come up with systems that would isolate the current government
from USAID or programs but at the same time would have some
positive? You are engaged in war-torn countries, you are
engaged in other dictatorships. Zimbabwe uses only $20 bills
for their money and they have been cut off from everyone except
basically the South Africans for a long time.
So, let me rephrase that. The Chinese are actively in
there, but would you give me your, for that particular country
because I was so recently there.
Ambassador Nagy. Yes, sir. And, interestingly enough, we
had a trade delegation from Zimbabwe not long ago visit here
and they were warmly welcomed. They had some of the government
ministers with them. And we told them exactly as did I in my
meetings with the high level officials, if they could take a
couple of steps then we could start reevaluating our whole
relationship because Zimbabwe has phenomenal potential.
And I am passionate about Zimbabwe because my triplets were
born there and I know what the country can do. So if they could
very quickly return to a prosperous path if the government
would just--they are saying the right things. It would be nice
if they actually did some of the things that they are talking
about.
But I think the United States business community would
stand ready to engage with them very quickly because there are
a number of sectors where we could have very fruitful
relations, sir.
Mr. Chabot. The gentleman's time has expired.
Mr. Issa. Thank you. And if you would just for the record
share with us, if you can, the request you made that would
allow for that.
Ambassador Nagy. Is that okay, sir?
Mr. Chabot. Yes, briefly.
Ambassador Nagy. All right. Yes, very quickly. There are
two acts that they have passed, one is the Public Order and
Security Act and the other is the Access to Information and
Protection of Privacy Act, which is if they would just withdraw
those that would be quite significant. Thank you.
Mr. Issa. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Mr. Chabot. Another gentleman from California, Mr. Bera is
recognized for 5 minutes.
Mr. Bera. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And I will echo the
remarks of our colleagues with thanks to Chairman Royce as he
moves on to his next endeavors as well as the other members of
this committee. And certainly with incoming chairman Eliot
Engel hopefully we will continue to operate in a bipartisan
way.
Also, while I disagree with the President's approach to
foreign policy, I appreciate the lifetime of service of our
diplomats and our aid and development workers all around the
world and applaud the work that both of you are doing. We have
had Ambassador Green in front of this committee several times
and I do think USAID is moving in the right direction looking
at capacity building and certainly expect Congress to support
that.
So given we have talked about the potential in Africa. If I
were to just frame the challenges that we see, we obviously see
a tremendous youth bulge that is occurring. Thirty thousand
Africans entering the job market on a daily basis, that is a
tremendous challenge. We see millions of people displaced
throughout Africa. We see future challenges of food and water
and security on the continent which will continue to create
some instability.
I was just in Sierra Leone, a fledgling democracy that is
coming out of years of civil war and had tremendous challenges
with the West African Ebola crisis where we are engaged, but I
would say I saw more Chinese while I was there as well, which
again presents a challenge that many of my colleagues have
talked about.
So we are framing the challenges, but I am an optimist and
we have been spending some time trying to understand how PEPFAR
came about being in a Republican administration with Democratic
Members of Congress. And really underlying that was a national
security threat assessment that if millions of people died of
HIV/AIDS it would create massive instability on that and create
governmental instability. And what we have just laid out
suggests that if we don't take a long-term view of these
challenges in Africa you will continue to have an unstable
continent.
I think my question to both of you is as Congress reasserts
its authority and Members of Congress tend to be here longer
than one administration to another, we have to take a
nonpartisan approach to looking at Africa in the long term and
often we don't. We shift from one administration. So that is if
we were looking at long-term strategies, what would that time
frame look like and then if you were recommending Congress
looking at what the foundational strategies would be for the
continent, what would you recommend our focus be? And I think
the BUILD Act is a real strong first step.
Ambassador Nagy. Exactly, sir. I want to again congratulate
the Congress with the BUILD Act because that has strengthened
my talking points when I go to Africa. The other one I would
really point to is the Young African Leaders Initiative,
because as you said, sir, Africa's future is its youth and
there is going to be millions and millions and millions of
young Africans that are going to be wanting good jobs and if
they don't get them they will either go to Europe or choose a
very destructive path.
So programs such as that I have found to be so successful
because everywhere I go to visit in Africa I run into the Young
African Leaders Initiative network and those people are so
dynamic, so entrepreneurial, and we are teaching exactly the
skills that the future Africa will need.
Mr. Bera. The programs like that don't require a lot of
taxpayer dollars and in fact they are capacity building.
Ambassador Nagy. No, they don't. And no, they are just
phenomenal programs. So those are the two that--how we can
encourage foreign direct investment from U.S. businesses and
how we can build on this huge youth bulge to make sure that
they look to the Western models for the future and not other
places.
Mr. Bera. And then, Mr. Day, if I could just ask a quick
question. As we think about aid and development in the 21st
century, we have already touched on it won't just be U.S.
taxpayer dollars, it will be trying to leverage private
investment, public investment, and then also working with the
international community as well. And if you could just briefly
give a vision of what you think aid and development looks like
in the 21st century.
Mr. Day. Thank you, Congressman. I think Administrator
Green has laid out a very clear vision for how he views USAID's
future and that future is what we term the journey to self-
reliance, which is working with our African partners to help
them on their path toward self-reliance, which we ultimately
define as their ability to plan, finance, and implement their
own development solutions to their own challenges.
And so if we have the level of commitment which is so
critical and we have a good partner on the ground, then in many
cases our programs are more successful, we get much better
results. And so the private sector is absolutely a critical
component of this, but it is also important that we have good
partners on the ground. And in many cases we do, in some cases
we do not.
Mr. Bera. All right. My time has expired.
Mr. Royce [presiding]. We will go to Mr. Mike McCaul of
Texas.
Mr. McCaul. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I just got out of my
monthly threat briefing as chairman of the Homeland Security
Committee, and I think the good news is that in the last--well,
in 2016, the threat from ISIS was extreme. External operations,
we were arresting one per week in the United States it seemed
like, and I think over the last 2 years we have crushed them
and the so-called caliphate.
But the threat hasn't completely gone away. I think the
good news is it has been downgraded to some extent, but then
they have moved. They are still maybe in the Euphrates area,
but the threat seems to be emerging more in Africa. And so I
know there are about 10,000 ISIS and al-Qaeda jihadists in
Africa today and to put that in perspective, before 9/11 there
were about 100 al-Qaeda that existed.
So it concerns me. I think, and I look forward to next
Congress in this committee focusing on this issue because I
think we are going to be looking at foreign adversary nation
states, but I think the threat of radical Islamist terror is
going to be focused in northern Africa and the Sahel.
Then-Congressman Pompeo and I, we traveled to Sinai and the
Egyptian Sinai Peninsula, Camp North, they evacuated it the day
we left due to the threat. We were in Tunisia, got briefed by
the Libyan team in exile. It is very much a hot threat there
and it is very hot in the Sahel region. We passed, thanks to
the chairman, my Trans-Sahara Counterterrorism Partnership Act
out of this committee which authorizes a program that you all
are working on. I think it is very valuable and I just wanted
to maybe just get your general assessment of what I am talking
about in terms of the threat in Africa and what can we do.
And we also passed a fragility of states bill which I think
deals with fragile nations where terrorism can breed out of.
Can you kind of talk about holistically what the State
Department is doing to counter this threat?
Ambassador Nagy. Yes, sir. Thank you very much. Indeed, the
threat is increasing in Africa especially in the Sahelian
region, a whole number of reasons which would take a long time
to discuss, but basically the fundamental issue remains. We can
get rid of the terrorists thanks to the efficiency of forces
and allies and people that we are with, but once you get rid of
the terrorists you have to fill that space with the government
because if you don't then another group of terrorists will come
along, which is in many cases worse than the last group, which
is exactly what had happened in Somalia up to now.
So we are working very, very closely with the French, with
the Malians, with the Nigerians, with the Chadians, with this
new G5 force that five of the countries have set up and we are
supporting them exactly, so that not only is it a military
campaign but it is also a governance campaign that once you
recapture territory then you do start providing the services
that the people demand so it is not another terrorist group
that comes along and does the exact same thing, sir.
Mr. McCaul. I agree. I think Libya is a good example where
even the military can't get General Haftar in the east and one
in the west and they can't get--if you have no military, you
have no governance and so it is a big problem there.
Mr. Day?
Mr. Day. I certainly agree with the Assistant Secretary's
comments. Particularly in the Sahel there are just chronic
vulnerabilities, water scarcity, low access to education, low
access to health services and we think that this is absolutely
critical to address. And so we have robust programs throughout
the region, particularly in Burkina Faso and in Niger that is
where our best partnerships are, but we continue to be very
concerned about the situation.
Mr. McCaul. Well, thank you. And I look forward to
addressing this again next Congress. And with that, Mr.
Chairman, I am going to yield back the balance of my time.
Mr. Royce. Well, thank you, Mr. McCaul. Thanks for
introducing that resolution for wildlife trafficking and rhino
horn in China. I think keeping Beijing engaged on this issue is
important.
Mr. McCaul. And will the gentleman yield? I think that is
another issue where they illegally sell rhinos and wildlife and
then it is a terror-financing operation. And so I look forward
to--thank you, Mr. Chairman, for----
Mr. Royce. Yeah, we appreciate the fact that when we put
the legislation forward to abolish the ivory trade that Beijing
stepped up and closed those carving stations. But keeping the
pressure on is going to be important.
We go to Lois Frankel of Florida.
Ms. Frankel. Thank you. It is sort of sad that I say thank
you, Mr. Chair, to you, Mr. Royce, for the last time here. I
just want to thank you. It has been such an honor and a
pleasure to serve with you. And I think it is very fitting, I
think of how many times I have ended up being here with you at
the end with hardly anyone around.
So I think it is----
Mr. Royce. You always saw these hearings through and thank
you.
Ms. Frankel. And so did you.
And I want to thank you two gentlemen for the work that you
do. I want to start with a story and then I will make a point,
and it is the story of a 30 year old HIV positive mother of two
living in Mozambique who lost her husband to AIDS last year and
she turned to a local clinic for help when she discovered she
was HIV positive, the clinic gave her medicine to stay alive
and healthy.
Now because of the expansion and expanded global gag rule,
her clinic is one of dozens in Mozambique that has been forced
to shut down and she has nowhere to go. Now I want to be kind
to you because I don't think you invented this policy, but I am
very alarmed. I am very worried about what is happening to
women all over the world because some of the policies of the
Trump administration.
And I will say this. No matter what you want to talk about
and talk about progress, if we don't advance girls and women
there will be no progress. There will not be economic progress,
there will not be progress in security of the world. Now I saw
a chart that has shocked me and this chart shows me what the
Trump's global gag rule is doing.
Now what we have had other administrations have gag rules
which is basically prevents, they have prevented U.S. foreign
aid for family planning to be cut off if even there is a
mention of abortion or referral to a service that does
abortion. Now under the Trump version--and that cut off $575
million in foreign aid which is terrible. I don't think the
original gag rules are good. I think it is inhumane and I think
it is stupid, all right.
But here is Trump's version. It can cut up to $8.8 billion
in U.S. foreign aid for health programs including family
planning, HIV, tuberculosis, malaria, maternal and child health
because it is cutting off funding to these entities even if
with their own money either perform a legal abortion or they
refer to a legal abortion or they give all the information that
is necessary for women to understand what her choices are.
And I just, it would be absolutely, you would be outraged--
I don't mean you personally, but we would be outraged and we
are if women were forced to have abortions. That would be wrong
and inhumane, but to force women to have children against their
will is also to me inhumane. And now that is not all that is
going on though. I wish I could say that.
The Trump administration has also cut off millions and
millions of dollars in funding to the U.N. Population Fund
which works in 150 countries to provide critical services
including maternal care, treatment for survivors of sexual
violence, and combating harmful practices like child marriage,
genital mutilation. So, I mean, you can talk all day about
advances, but if we are holding women back, we are pushing them
back, there is not going to be advances. So I guess my question
to you is what is the replacement for all these maternal and
women's health services that are being cut off?
Mr. Day. Thank you, Congresswoman. And I certainly agree
with you that for communities to progress women and children
must progress as well. That said, the U.S. remains by far the
largest donor of global health programs in the world and we
remain committed to supporting the health of women and
children. And we have programs all around the world. I will
certainly check on the particular issue----
Ms. Frankel. Thank you.
Mr. Day [continuing]. In Mozambique, but ending child
marriage, ending FGM, gender-based violence, these are all
issues that USAID continues to have robust programs in support
of all across the continent of Africa.
Ms. Frankel. Well, to just finish up here, Mr. Chair. This
is not a criticism of USAID which does very, very good work.
But what, from my point of view, the Trump administration has
been eliminating many, many good partners and what I would ask
is that you bring back to this committee a full report as to
who is making up the difference for all these programs that are
potentially defunded because of the expansion of the global gag
rule and because of the cutting off of the money to the U.N.
Population Fund.
And I thank you again for your service and with that, Mr.
Royce, I am so sorry for the last time to yield back, but again
it has been an honor.
Mr. Royce. Congresswoman Frankel, it has been an honor for
me to work with you. Thank you very much.
And I want to thank Ted Yoho here because we have been
talking about the BUILD Act and as we have heard today that is
going to double your book of business and all the new
authorities that you have there. I appreciate his travels to
Africa, his work also in Asia, but on this BUILD Act as a
counterweight to Beijing, this is really critical. And I also
thank him for his work on wildlife trafficking.
And Congresswoman Frankel, thank you for your work and
traveling with me on so many occasions. I really appreciate it.
Congressman Yoho?
Mr. Yoho. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And I too want to
reiterate what everybody says. But I know I am in good hands
because I have got you looking right over my shoulder up there
on the wall of the Foreign Affairs past chairmen looking over
us, so I know we will do well. We will miss you and I thank you
for your leadership and your mentorship.
Moving on, it is apparent that the U.S. must be fully
engaged in Africa as the chairman stated in his opening
statement, because if we do not, a void is created and grows as
Africa grows and others will fill that, primarily China,
Russia, or terrorist organizations. With the right lack of
governance and all that they can expand, as we have seen. And
with Boko Haram, there are 2 million displaced because of them
and so that void has to be filled.
But how we engage matters and I know you will agree with
that, we can engage post breakdown of societies or not the
development of societies or then conflicts are there and it is
a rougher way to go in there to try to fix something that is
broken, or we can be proactive and help direct the direction of
those countries to be able to fulfill the needs of what those
wants are in that country. And the best way is through smart
investments and infrastructure leading to economic development
and to develop those countries it is essential that we move.
And, Mr. Day, I heard you talking about transitioning from
the aid and trade, and our mantra has been saying we want to
transition countries from aid to trade as quick as we can and
if we look at our top 15 trading partners, of those where 12 of
them were once recipients of foreign aid. Saying that, my
questions are recognizing the diversity among African
countries, what is your assessment on the region's economic
growth and how do you choose the best country to work with?
We will start with you Ambassador Nagy.
Ambassador Nagy. How do we choose the best countries to
work with. That would come through our engagement with them on
which countries are really, really ready to move forward and to
accept the types of business environments which exactly you
were talking about, low levels of corruption, being really
interested in their own people bilaterally, but also there is
another factor because the regions also matter.
And this time I am really, really encouraged because the
MCC is able to do regional projects, so that is also very
important because Africa's natural units are in fact its
regions because of the old colonial boundaries----
Mr. Yoho. Right.
Ambassador Nagy [continuing]. But often regions make a lot
more sense. So we can really engage to see which of the regions
are ready, which of the countries are really ready to move
forward to put into policies and priorities which will benefit
their own people.
Mr. Yoho. It perplexes me, because we look over there and
there are places that don't have water. They don't have
electricity. This is the 21st century. We know how to do these.
And what we see prohibiting that are bad government or the
despots they don't care about the people, they care about their
personal gain.
We can't fix every country today, but if we can build on
the success. And you were talking about the mission in Liberia
was a success and we know success breeds success. So can we
build around countries in that same area and that same region
that say I want what they have and we are willing to come to
the table and do what we have to, are you finding that, Mr.
Day? We will ask you.
Mr. Day. We are, the short answer. And I think also to
answer your question about how do we choose, how USAID engages
with our partners on the ground, USAID is transforming the way
that we do business and that is all part of the journey to
self-reliance.
But part of that is we want to be more data-driven in our
decision making. In fact, we have developed these self-reliant
road maps that actually can bring together 17 third-party
objective open source data sources so that we can have a better
picture as to where these countries are on that path and then
also helps us guide some of those investments. It is not
determinative, but it is a conversation starter and a tool that
we use.
Mr. Yoho. Okay. We wanted, when we started to draft the
BUILD Act our goal was to move countries from aid to trade.
Mr. Day. Yeah.
Mr. Yoho. We wanted to build on the OPIC model that has
returned money to the American taxpayers 40 out of 41 years.
How will the BUILD Act improve U.S. companies' competitiveness
in Africa and what should their key areas of focus be as they
look to better support U.S. companies? And I have only got a
few seconds.
Ambassador Nagy. With each country that will be different,
sir, because in some, for example, the tourism sector could
really, really be exploited to create work. Others it is
agricultural development and productivity and processing, so it
depends country to country. But thanks to the BUILD Act it is a
wide spectrum and again I heard that from the American business
community and the African leaders themselves.
Mr. Yoho. Thank you.
Mr. Chairman, I take this opportunity to yield back to you
for the last time and it has been an honor.
Mr. Royce. It has been an honor, Mr. Yoho, to work with
you.
Ambassador Ann Wagner.
Mrs. Wagner. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, for hosting this
hearing and I will echo my colleagues. I cannot think of a more
fitting way for you to close out your esteemed time and
leadership on this committee than to reflect on the immense
progress we have seen in relations between the United States
and our African partners and a chart path toward future shared
growth.
Ambassador Nagy, I am deeply concerned about China's
attempts to expand its control over the global cobalt market to
African producers. It has recently come to my attention that
China is now seeking to derail a U.S.-Cameroonian memorandum of
understanding on cobalt production. This strikes me as a
serious national security risk. Already the U.S. military buys
most of the cobalt it uses for guided missiles production from
China, and frankly a partnership on cobalt production with
Cameroon would greatly benefit both countries.
How is the State Department working with the Cameroonian
Government to get the memorandum of understanding back on
track?
Ambassador Nagy. Thank you for the question. Unfortunately
I am not familiar with the issue so I will have to get back to
you on that.
Mrs. Wagner. Mr. Day, anything?
Mr. Day. I will defer to the Assistant Secretary.
Ambassador Nagy. But I will--can I just add one quick--
during my last visit to West Africa, interestingly, the
President of Guinea said that they had some potential cobalt
there and we are following up on that one.
Mrs. Wagner. We could use the extra partnership. It would
be helpful to both, and I do not want China once again
interfering in a very important memorandum of understanding.
So moving on, my colleagues and I have long sought to
counter Boko Haram's campaign to use unspeakable violence
against schoolgirls to gain international notoriety. Last
February, I was appalled to learn that Boko Haram had abducted
112 schoolgirls from a town in northeast Nigeria. While most
were thankfully released a month later, one brave little girl,
a 15-year-old, Leah Sharibu, remains in captivity because she
refused to abandon her Christian faith.
Ambassador Nagy, how is the United States working to secure
Leah's safe release?
Ambassador Nagy. Leah Sharibu definitely remains a priority
for us. Our Ambassador is seized with it as is the rest of the
mission. We bring her up and as a matter of fact President
Buhari himself is following up on that on a continuous basis.
But one of the things that we have avoided is mentioning it too
much in public because then the value to the terrorists keeps
going up. But I can assure you that we are working very
energetically as much as possible to obtain her release.
Mrs. Wagner. Thank you. Although Rwanda's authoritarian
government under Paul Kagame recently acquitted opposition
leader Diane Rwigara of trumped up charges brought against her,
many worry that the government's intent is to intimidate its
critics and political enemies.
Mr. Day, what does Ms. Rwigara's acquittal mean for dissent
and free speech in Rwanda?
Mr. Day. USAID has been working in Rwanda for quite some
time and with a wide variety of different programs. And you
will have to forgive me, I will have to look into that
particular issue. Our primary support has been for the Rwandan
people. We certainly have been concerned with some of the
closing spaces in Rwanda, but we continue to work with civil
society and a variety of different groups to support the people
of Rwanda so that they have a voice into their own future. But
I will look into that particular issue.
Mrs. Wagner. Thank you. A few months after Emmerson
Mnangagwa replaced strong man Robert Mugabe as President of
Zimbabwe, we have seen disappointingly few improvements. Mr.
Day, what is the situation on the ground in Zimbabwe and how
does USAID support the growth of Zimbabwe's civil society?
Mr. Day. I will defer this to the Secretary on the
political analysis, but similar to Rwanda we are certainly very
concerned about the political situation in Zimbabwe in terms of
an operating space. Our priority of course continues to be the
support of the Zimbabwean people who have been under tremendous
distress for a number of decades. And so our programs are
focused on humanitarian assistance and supporting civil society
so they again can have a voice in their own.
Mrs. Wagner. Thank you. Ambassador Nagy?
Ambassador Nagy. Yes, ma'am. On the ground, the Zimbabwean
Government is saying some fairly positive things, but we are
still waiting for some action on the two laws that I mentioned
previously.
Mrs. Wagner. Right. All right, well, thank you. I look
forward to some responses to some of the questions that I had
and I appreciate your service and your time today.
Mr. Chairman, I also for the last time yield back. It has
been an honor and a privilege to work with you here in
Congress.
Mr. Royce. Thank you, Ambassador.
We go to John Curtis of Utah.
Mr. Curtis. Thank you. Mr. Chairman, I would, like many of
my colleagues, like to emphasize two themes that we have heard
throughout these hearings. One is thank you for your service.
It has been an honor to be the youngest member of your
committee and to be here.
The second theme is this influence of China, and I think
you have adequately answered this over and over in today's
hearing, so I am not going to really ask you a question other
than to join my colleagues in expressing concern and
acknowledging that despite the amazing work that we do, the
over $8 billion of investment that we make there, that sometime
China comes in and negates all of that with these tempting
short-term offers. So just add my voice to the concern and the
reality of that. Usually around the globe you see as a partner
in crime Russia in many regions and we haven't really touched
on that. Could you share with us the influence of Russia on the
continent and tell us what concerns you have there?
Ambassador Nagy. Thank you very much, exactly right.
Russia, while in no way bringing the amount of resources that
China has, they are trying to be very opportunistic and
transactional where for a low investment they can maximize
their influence. I point specifically to the Central African
Republic where the Russians used an authorization from the U.N.
Security Council to provide some weapons to the Central African
Government to bring in several hundred private security people.
Now the President's security advisor is a Russian. The
Russians have trained the presidential guard. They are also
exploiting some mineral resources, so they have inserted
themselves into the Central African Republic at relatively low
cost. Those are the types of opportunities that they are
looking at and they will continue looking at and we have to be
very vigilant and monitor their activities closely, sir.
Mr. Curtis. Thank you. Botswana is home to a large
population or a high percentage of the elephants in the region.
And we talked and you have referred a little bit to the illegal
hunting and problems that we have had and we have had almost no
discussion about potential legal opportunities there, and the
ban on elephant hunting is viewed in many regions in Botswana
as harmful. Some of the economic development of the small
villages is dependent, was dependent on that.
So while the illegal trafficking is going on, we have kind
of shut this down, the folks on the ground will tell you they
don't mind reasonable restrictions based on scientific data,
but that there has been almost no scientific data put behind
the ban. What role would be appropriate for the United States
in determining what is good for legal harvesting of elephants
in the region?
Mr. Day. I would be happy to look into the issue and get
back to you. The only thing I will say is that we have had a
longstanding and good partnership with the Botswanan Government
and we have robust wildlife trafficking programs. Our programs
particularly in Botswana have been focused on HIV and AIDS, but
I will look into the particular issue of them.
Mr. Curtis. Thank you. I walked in--I was here for almost
all 2\1/2\ hours of the hearing but stepped out for a moment
and when I came back in you were talking about Rwanda. And so I
don't know if you touched on this while I was gone, but if not
could you address the problem with the closing of the churches?
And Rwanda has made so much progress it seems to be a step
backward. Is that on the radar of the administration and are we
seeing some improvements there?
Ambassador Nagy. It is. We have not seen any improvements
lately, but it is very much on the radar screen of the
administration because we believe that that particular law was
very counterproductive. We understand the purpose that they
were trying to get at, but we felt that the mechanism was
totally wrong because it was infringing on freedom of religion
instead of--if there is a problem with certain churches that
are breaking the law or are not real churches, then you use the
law to affect them, not with a sledgehammer.
Mr. Curtis. That is what it felt like.
My final question is that oftentimes in these voids of
uncertainty and disruption you will find ISIS and al-Qaeda. We
haven't talked about that much today. Can you tell us what you
are seeing in the region with the growth of these terrorist
organizations and what we need to be looking for?
Ambassador Nagy. Absolutely. Both of those are very
opportunistic and different terrorist groups in Africa have
aligned themselves with one or the other global organizations.
And sometimes they do that as a mark of trying to be
recognized, and other times, for example, the new group that
has crept up in Mozambique are also calling themselves that
even though there is absolutely no ties to them.
Mr. Curtis. Right.
Ambassador Nagy. But as I mentioned before, the terrorist
threat is growing. It is becoming much more serious. It is
creeping into places and countries where it has not existed
before. That is why we have to be very, very active and
engaging with international partners, with the African
countries, and all of our friends to confront them wherever
they exist. Mozambique is a good example because it has just
started and there is still an opportunity to stop it in its
infancy. So it is critically important to give it attention
there, not to let happen what happened with, say, Boko Haram,
sir.
Mr. Curtis. Good. Thank you. I am out of time. Mr.
Chairman, I yield back.
Mr. Royce. Thank you very much, John. We go now to Mr. Ted
Poe of Texas.
Mr. Poe. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I want to echo my
colleagues' comments. Thank you for chairing this committee for
so many years. It has been a wonderful privilege to be here
with you. We are both leaving Congress. I am back to Texas and
you are back to the foreign country of California. It has been
a pleasure working with you and best wishes in the future. I
think the country is better because of your leadership over the
last 6 years and even longer than that. You chaired the same
subcommittee that I am chairing, the Terrorism,
Nonproliferation, and Trade Subcommittee, so thank you on
behalf of the people of Texas for your leadership in foreign
affairs.
Mr. Royce. Thank you, Judge. I might come see you sometime
in the winter in Texas.
Mr. Poe. You are always welcome. You are always welcome,
sir.
Gentlemen, thank you for being here. I want to cut right to
the chase. Wildlife trafficking in Africa is a great concern
especially as I see things taking place and it is not getting
better for the animals. You have corruption with governments in
Africa. You have the slaughter of rhinos for their horns. And
the horns, I understand, are grounded down into powder and
shipped illegally to Vietnam.
You have the elephants and the tusk being sold in China on
the illegal market, but the bottom line is you got the
disappearance of wildlife in Africa that may become extinct. My
12 grandkids, it may be the only time they see rhinos or
elephants are in Disney movies or Disney cartoons in the
future. I am not being facetious. So what is the plan to
improve that situation especially in those two areas, those two
animals?
Mr. Day. Thank you, Congressman. As you said this is an
absolutely critical issue. Biodiversity conservation is
absolutely critical to the health of African communities. USAID
has prioritized this issue and will continue to do so. Twenty-
five percent of the agency's biodiversity funding goes directly
toward wildlife trafficking. We have 65 projects in 25
countries and so it is something that we work tirelessly at
protecting.
Mr. Poe. Excuse me, Mr. Day.
Mr. Day. Yes.
Mr. Poe. Are we winning, are we losing?
Mr. Day. It is a complex issue and it is----
Mr. Poe. That means we are losing. We are losing. Complex
means we are losing. I am not faulting you, I am just, I want
to know because this is a--I guess, really, the question is
what can we do better to make sure that these animals don't
become extinct. What can we do, Congress, administration?
Mr. Day. I think from our perspective if we had more
greater engagement both at the host country level, the
international donor community, as well as the private sector,
as I mentioned earlier in the testimony we can't do this
without the engagement of the private sector. And that is not
to say that they are not engaged now, but we do need more
engagement from the private sector. We believe that that is
where the vast majority of the force and the power is going to
come from.
Mr. Poe. And I agree with you on that too, the private
sector as well.
Ambassador, do you want to weigh in on this?
Ambassador Nagy. The only thing I would add, sir, is that I
think it is also critically important to engage local
communities, because if you can persuade them of the value of
the wildlife for their own livelihood when it is tourism,
economic development, and factors like that, then that helps us
win that much easier because the local folks know what is going
on.
Mr. Poe. It seems to me I can understand why the bad things
are happening. You have everybody involved. You have the local
game wardens, if I can use that phrase, who make almost nothing
a year, all of a sudden being given a bribe to look the other
way while terrorists or whoever wants to kill animals on the
property and it just seems that the international community,
especially the United States, needs to be directly involved in
this before it is too late. And then we will wring our hands
and say, oh, I wish we would have done something different in
the past.
I don't know if it is going after the Vietnamese
Government, going after the Chinese Government, certainly going
after the terrorists who were involved in doing this and
getting rid of those do-bads, in my opinion. I would just hope
that Congress, the administration, the private, and God bless
those private entities that are trying to do what they can to
preserve animals.
Is there any talk about--one last question, Mr. Chairman--
any talk about removing those species from certain areas of
Africa and relocating them somewhere else?
Mr. Day. I would have to check on those types of
discussions. I do know that removal of certain species from
certain areas is extraordinarily expensive, so I know there are
resource issues there. But I am happy to look into what the
current discussions are.
Mr. Poe. I would appreciate you getting back with me on
that. We certainly can bring some of them to Texas, it would be
fine with me. I am just speaking on my behalf.
Thank you both, gentlemen. Thank you again, Mr. Chairman.
And that is just the way it is.
Mr. Royce. Well, thank you. I share the judge's sense of
urgency on this and I think that is why we need fully funded
programs. That is why we need full diplomatic engagement and
also why we need the Departments of State and Defense, both
working with the game wardens whose lives are on the line there
in Africa who are trying to stand off these poachers where they
are outgunned and outnumbered.
But let me thank Ambassador Nagy and Mr. Day for being here
to testify before us and I hope the entire administration is
listening to us today. Clearly there is strong bipartisan
support for well-resourced, broad engagement in Africa. We have
got to be present there. We have got to continue our effort
there to be active in Africa, to build partner capacity, to
combat terrorism, to foster trade and development.
As the judge said, to end wildlife trafficking there, to
strengthen health systems there, and of course to support good
governance. Too much is at stake, too much for Americans, too
much is at stake for Africans alike. And with that, this
hearing is adjourned.
[Whereupon, at 12:21 p.m., the committee was adjourned.]
A P P E N D I X
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