[House Hearing, 116 Congress] [From the U.S. Government Publishing Office] CONTINUING CHALLENGES TO THE VOTING RIGHTS ACT SINCE ``SHELBY COUNTY V. HOLDER'' ======================================================================= HEARING BEFORE THE SUBCOMMITTEE ON THE CONSTITUTION, CIVIL RIGHTS, AND CIVIL LIBERTIES of the COMMITTEE ON THE JUDICIARY HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES ONE HUNDRED SIXTEENTH CONGRESS FIRST SESSION __________ JUNE 25, 2019 __________ Serial No. 116-31 __________ Printed for the use of the Committee on the Judiciary [GRAPHIC NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT] Available http://judiciary.house.gov or www.govinfo.gov __________ U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE 39-717 WASHINGTON : 2020 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- COMMITTEE ON THE JUDICIARY JERROLD NADLER, New York, Chairman ZOE LOFGREN, California DOUG COLLINS, Georgia, SHEILA JACKSON LEE, Texas Ranking Member STEVE COHEN, Tennessee F. JAMES SENSENBRENNER, Jr., HENRY C. ``HANK'' JOHNSON, Jr., Wisconsin Georgia STEVE CHABOT, Ohio THEODORE E. DEUTCH, Florida LOUIE GOHMERT, Texas KAREN BASS, California JIM JORDAN, Ohio CEDRIC L. RICHMOND, Louisiana KEN BUCK, Colorado HAKEEM S. JEFFRIES, New York JOHN RATCLIFFE, Texas DAVID N. CICILLINE, Rhode Island MARTHA ROBY, Alabama ERIC SWALWELL, California MATT GAETZ, Florida TED LIEU, California MIKE JOHNSON, Louisiana JAMIE RASKIN, Maryland ANDY BIGGS, Arizona PRAMILA JAYAPAL, Washington TOM McCLINTOCK, California VAL BUTLER DEMINGS, Florida DEBBIE LESKO, Arizona J. LUIS CORREA, California GUY RESCHENTHALER, Pennsylvania MARY GAY SCANLON, Pennsylvania, BEN CLINE, Virginia Vice-Chair KELLY ARMSTRONG, North Dakota SYLVIA R. GARCIA, Texas W. GREGORY STEUBE, Florida JOE NEGUSE, Colorado LUCY McBATH, Georgia GREG STANTON, Arizona MADELEINE DEAN, Pennsylvania DEBBIE MUCARSEL-POWELL, Florida VERONICA ESCOBAR, Texas Perry Apelbaum, Majority Staff Director & Chief Counsel Brendan Belair, Minority Staff Director ------ SUBCOMMITTEE ON THE CONSTITUTION, CIVIL RIGHTS, AND CIVIL LIBERTIES STEVE COHEN, Tennessee, Chair JAMIE RASKIN, Maryland MIKE JOHNSON, Louisiana, ERIC SWALWELL, California Ranking Member MARY GAY SCANLON, Pennsylvania LOUIE GOHMERT, Texas MADELEINE DEAN, Pennsylvania JIM JORDAN, Ohio SYLVIA R. GARCIA, Texas GUY RESCHENTHALER, Pennsylvania VERONICA ESCOBAR, Texas BEN CLINE, Virginia SHEILA JACKSON LEE, Texas KELLY ARMSTRONG, North Dakota James Park, Chief Counsel Paul Taylor, Minority Counsel C O N T E N T S ---------- JUNE 25, 2019 OPENING STATEMENTS Page The Honorable Steve Cohen, Chairman, Subcommittee on the Constitution, Civil Rights, and Civil Liberties................ 41 The Honorable Mike Johnson, Ranking Member, Subcommittee on the Constitution, Civil Rights, and Civil Liberties................ 43 The Honorable Jerrold Nadler, Chairman, Committee on the Judiciary...................................................... 45 The Honorable Doug Collins, Ranking Member, Committee on the Judiciary...................................................... 47 WITNESS Kristen Clarke, President & Executive Director, National Lawyers' Committee for Civil Rights Under Law Oral Testimony............................................... 2 Prepared Testimony........................................... 4 The Honorable Stacey Abrams, Chair, Fair Fight Action Oral Testimony............................................... 49 Prepared Testimony........................................... 52 The Honorable Kyle Hawkins, Solicitor General of Texas, Office of the Texas Attorney General Oral Testimony............................................... 57 Prepared Testimony........................................... 59 Leah C. Aden, Deputy Director of Litigation, NAACP Legal Defense & Educational Fund, Inc. Oral Testimony............................................... 83 Prepared Testimony........................................... 86 LETTERS, STATEMENTS, ETC., SUBMITTED FOR THE HEARING Item for the record submitted by the Honorable Sylvia Garcia, Subcommittee on the Constitution, Civil Rights, and Civil Liberties...................................................... 113 Item for the record submitted by the Honorable Veronica Escobar, Subcommittee on the Constitution, Civil Rights, and Civil Liberties...................................................... 161 Statement for the record submitted by the Honorable Sheila Jackson Lee, Subcommittee on the Constitution, Civil Rights, and Civil Liberties............................................ 166 Item for the record submitted by the Honorable Doug Collins, Ranking Member, Committee on the Judiciary..................... 179 APPENDIX Item for the record submitted by The Honorable Steve Cohen, Chairman, Subcommittee on the Constitution, Civil Rights, and Civil Liberties................................................ 192 CONTINUING CHALLENGES TO THE VOTING RIGHTS ACT SINCE SHELBY COUNTY V. HOLDER ---------- TUESDAY, JUNE 25, 2019 House of Representatives Subcommittee on the Constitution, Civil Rights, and Civil Liberties Committee on the Judiciary Washington, DC. The subcommittee met, pursuant to call, at 2:44 p.m., in Room 2141, Rayburn House Office Building, Hon. Steve Cohen [chairman of the subcommittee] presiding. Present: Representatives Cohen, Nadler, Raskin, Dean, Garcia, Escobar, Jackson, Johnson, Collins, Gohmert, Jordan, Reschenthaler, Cline, and Armstrong Staff Present: David Greengrass, Senior Counsel; John Doty, Senior Advisor; Lisette Morton, Director, Policy Planning and Member Services; Madeline Strasser, Chief Clerk; Moh Sharma, Member Services and Outreach Advisor; Susan Jensen, Parliamentarian/Senior Counsel; Julian Gerson, Staff Assistant; Keenan Keller, Senior Counsel; Will Emmons, Professional Staff Member; Paul Taylor, Minority Counsel; and Andrea Woodard, Minority Professional Staff Member. Mr. Cohen. The Committee on the Judiciary Subcommittee on the Constitution, Civil Rights, and Civil Liberties will come to order. Without objection, the chair is authorized to declare a recess of the subcommittee at any time. We welcome everyone's attendance here in the hearing on Continuing Challenges to the Voting Rights Act in Shelby County v. Holder. We know this is the 6th anniversary of Shelby County v. Holder. Normally, what we would do is I would give an opening statement of 5 minutes, and then the ranking member would give one of 5 minutes, but Ms. Clarke, one of our witnesses, has a 3:40 train, which would have been easy to accomplish if it weren't for the House of Representatives' schedule. And with the permission of the ranking member, we are going to go straight to her statement and then go back into the traditional my talk, he talk, somebody else talk, the panel. So Ms. Clarke, thank you so much for being here. Ms. Clarke is the President and Executive Director of the National Lawyers Committee for Civil Rights Under Law, one of the Nation's leading civil rights organizations. She previously worked for several years at the NAACP Legal Defense and Education Fund, where she helped lead the organization's work in the areas of voting rights and election law across the country and worked on cases defending the constitutionality of the Voting Rights Act. Prior to joining the Legal Defense Fund, she worked in the Civil Rights Division at the cannot of justice, serving as a prosecutor in the criminal section of the Division of Voting Rights and redistricting cases through the division's voting section. She received her J.D. from Columbia University and her Bachelor's degree from another ivy school called Harvard. I normally give you the warning. I give you the warning. You start, you have got a green light, it goes off in 4 minutes, a yellow light, and that means you have got--yellow light is off, you have to got to go to the train. You are recognized for 5 minutes. STATEMENTS OF KRISTEN CLARKE, PRESIDENT AND EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, NATIONAL LAWYERS' COMMITTEE FOR CIVIL RIGHTS UNDER LAW; HON. STACEY ABRAMS, FOUNDER AND CHAIR, FAIR FIGHT ACTION; HON. KYLE HAWKINS, SOLICITOR GENERAL OF TEXAS, OFFICE OF THE TEXAS ATTORNEY GENERAL; LEAH ADEN, DEPUTY DIRECTOR OF LITIGATION, NAACP LEGAL DEFENSE & EDUCATIONAL FUND, INC. STATEMENT OF KRISTEN CLARKE Ms. Clarke. Thank you, Chairman Cohen, Ranking Member Johnson, and members of the Subcommittee on the Constitution, Civil Rights, and Civil Liberties. My name is Kristen Clarke, and I serve as the President and Executive Director of the Lawyers' Committee for Civil Rights Under Law, and I thank you for the opportunity to testify today on challenges to voting rights. My testimony today is shaped by my experience as an attorney who started off her career enforcing Section 5 of the Voting Rights Act at the Justice Department, as someone who litigated the Shelby County versus Holder case, and as someone who has worked to protect voting rights their entire career. The Voting Rights Act of 1965 transformed American democracy, and the Supreme Court's evisceration of the Section 5 preclearance provision of the Act, coupled with a Justice Department that has abdicated its responsibility for enforcing remaining provisions of the Act, have placed the voting rights of our Nation's most vulnerable communities in peril. These dynamics have created a perfect storm, resulting in the resurgence of voting discrimination and voter suppression at levels not seen since the days of Jim Crow. It is worth underscoring that the current administration has not filed a single case under the Voting Rights Act. The Justice Department's silence is deafening. The Lawyers' Committee for Civil Rights Under Law has been at the forefront of the battle for equal voting rights since it was created in 1963 at the request of President John F. Kennedy to enlist the private bar's leadership and resources in combating voting discrimination and more. Today, our vast docket of voting rights litigation is among the most comprehensive and far-reaching, both geographically and in terms of issues raised, as any in the Nation. And by way of our election protection program, the Nation's largest nonpartisan voter protection effort, anchored by the 866 Our Vote hotline, we have vetted complaints from tens of thousand of voters since Shelby, many revealing systemic voting discrimination. In short, this is how Shelby has impacted our democracy. First, we have seen the resurgence of discriminatory voting practices, some motivated by intentional discrimination. And this discrimination has been most intense in the very jurisdictions that were once covered by Section 5. They range from the consolidation of polling sites to make it less convenient for minority voters to vote, to the curtailing of early voting hours, the purging of minority voters from the rolls under the pretext of list maintenance, strict photo ID requirements, abuse of signature match verification requirements to reject absentee ballots, the threat of criminal prosecution, and more. Second, we have seen increased levels of recalcitrance and hostility among elected officials who institute and reinstitute discriminatory voting changes with impunity. Well-known examples come out of North Carolina, where the legislature adopted an omnibus bill that the Fourth Circuit found was crafted with surgical precision. My written testimony includes an appendix that outlines several cases since the Shelby decision that evidence this hostility. Third, the loss of public notice regarding changes in voting practices that could have a discriminatory effect is significant. Most suppressive actions occur in small towns sprinkled across the country, where constant oversight is difficult, if not impossible. Fourth, the public no longer has the ability to participate in the process of reviewing practices before they take effect. And between 2000 and 2010, DOJ received between 4,500 and 5,500 submissions, capturing between 14,000 and 20,000 voting changes per year. Without Section 5, communities are in the dark, and unable to share critical information that can help to illuminate the discrimination that sometimes underlies voting changes. Fifth, the preclearance process had an identifiable deterrent effect that is now lost. Sixth, the status quo is not sustainable. Civil rights organizations are stepping up to fill the void created by the Shelby decision at insurmountable expense. And finally, this will be the first redistricting cycle in decades if Congress fails to restore the Voting Rights Act. A little over 12 years ago, both Chambers of Congress reauthorized the Act with tremendous bipartisan support. Many members of the House present for that vote are still here today. Bipartisan support for the Act has been consistent across the decades and should remain so today. The Supreme Court has put the ball in Congress' court, and this body must take action now to help our country safeguard the right to vote for all. Thank you. [The statement of Ms. Clarke follows:] [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT] Mr. Cohen. You are welcome, Ms. Clarke, and thank you for your testimony. Because you are leaving, I want to first thank you, and I want you to know we are going to have the hardest questions for you. You still have to answer questions that we give you in writing, and you are going to get the hardest ones. Ms. Clarke. I thank you, Chairman. Mr. Cohen. I am sure you will handle them deftly. Ms. Clarke. Absolutely. Thank you, Chairman. Mr. Cohen. You are welcome. Thank you so much. I will now recognize myself for an opening statement. The right to vote is the most fundamental right of citizenship in our democracy. It is the base where it all starts, and that is where it happens. Yet, for most of our Nation's history, too many of our citizens have been denied the right to vote. For over a century, women were denied the right to vote, and for a century and a half, African Americans were the most brutally attacked, denying their rights to vote, especially in the deep south. On August 6 of 1965, our Nation took a momentous step towards correcting that injustice when President Lyndon Johnson signed into law the Voting Rights Act. That was the results of years of efforts by the civil rights monument led by heroes like our colleague, Representative John Lewis, and Dr. Martin Luther King and others, to get Congress to act on protecting voting rights for African Americans. I fear, however, the developments of the last several years have undermined the Act's basic protections. That is because 6 years ago today in Shelby County v. Holder, the Supreme Court effectively suspended the Act's Section 5 preclearance requirement by striking down the coverage formula in Section 4 that determined which jurisdictions would be subject to preclearance. In essence, they said not necessarily that those jurisdictions that had been under preclearance had cleaned up their act, but there were other jurisdictions that were maybe equally as bad or had done bad deeds as well. So they let the bad actors out because they thought there were new bad actors, and they kind of opened the door for everybody. Under that preclearance requirement, certain jurisdictions, predominantly in the deep south that had a history of discriminatory voting methods, they were required to obtain the approval of the Justice Department or the U.S. District Court for the District of Columbia before any proposed changes to voting practices or procedures could take effect. That preclearance requirement was crucial to vigorous and effective enforcement of the Act's guarantee of equal voting rights. The purpose of this preclearance requirement is to ensure the jurisdictions that are most likely to discriminate against minority voters would bear the burden of proving that any change to their voting laws were not discriminatory, rather than placing the burden of proof on discrimination victims. By placing the burden on jurisdictions with a history of discrimination to prove their innocence, Section 5 rightly prevented potentially discriminatory voting practices from taking effect before they could harm minority voters. In this way, Section 5 proved to be a significant means of protection for the rights of minority voters. Section 2 of the Voting Rights Act, which prohibits discrimination voting and remains in effect is, by itself, a less effective and significantly more cumbersome and expensive way to enforce the Act, factors that would dissuade even those with meritorious claims from pursuing enforcement litigation. Most importantly, plaintiffs cannot invoke Section 2 until after an alleged harm has taken place, thereby eroding the effectiveness of the Act, which is to see that the harm doesn't ever take place. The result of these factors would be the many practices and restrictions that undermine equal votes will simply go unchallenged because the harm has been done. These are reasons why Congress has repeatedly reauthorized Section 5 on an overwhelmingly bipartisan basis, most recently in 2006, when the House passed the VRA by a vote of 390-33, in the Senate 98-0. So at this time, it wasn't the Congress' fault. We were good. Incredibly, the Court's majority in Shelby County claimed that there was no evidence to support Congress' findings of continued discrimination in voting in the then-covered jurisdictions, notwithstanding thousands of pages of record evidence compiled by this subcommittee in 2006. This subcommittee, then in Republican hands, demonstrated a continuing need for this coverage formula. Telling events since the Shelby County decision have proved how wrong the Court was in its conclusion. Within hours of the decision, States like Texas and North Carolina that have been the subject of the Act's preclearance requirement, announced their intent to impose strict voting identification requirements. Other States that had also been subject to preclearance also wasted no time pursuing voting restrictions, and, once again, threatened to undermine the minority of voting rights, including practices like restriction or elimination of early voting, same-day registration, and bans on ex-offenders from voting, all of which make it disproportionately harder for racial and ethnic minorities to vote. It has a disparate impact against black voters, African American voters. Last year's Georgia Governor's race brought into full view the range of voter suppression practices in formerly covered jurisdictions. It may look subtle when viewed in isolation, but are pernicious and devastating in their cumulative effect. As Ms. Stacey Abrams, one of our witnesses, the Democratic nominee for Governor of Georgia in that race, knows from personal experience, her opponent, Brian Kemp, then the Georgia Secretary of State, embarked on what were a series of seemingly naked attempts to shrink the electorate, which was the job of the Secretary of State on those laws, but he chose to go about it in a particular manner. He also was her opponent. He is now the Governor of Georgia. His office purged more than 1.4 million voters from the rolls since 2010, including more than 600,000 Georgians in the year 2017, and then another 90,000 that were not purged in 2017 in The Cleanup Act in 2018. Numerous voter registrations were cancelled because the voter had not voted in the previous election. Georgia also closed a tenth of its polling places since 2012, with the majority of closings occurring in poor counties, and those with significant African American populations. Georgia also enacted a, quote, ``exact match,'' unquote, law that resulted in 53,000 more voters being given only pending status on the voter registration because of minor errors on their registration forms, with more than 70 percent of those voters being African American. This is exactly the kind of attrition on voting rights that preclearance would have stopped from going into effect. Before the Voting Rights Act, the state of voting rights in the deep south was abysmal. In the mid 1950s, only one in four African American voters in the south was registered. With this robust preclearance requirement, the Act did dramatic positive effect on black voting registration in the south, which increased to 62 percent just 3 years after the Act became law, yet these gains and others are at risk because of the Shelby decision. The Supreme Court was wrong, in my opinion, to undermine the Voting Rights Act. Congress failed to act the last time we had a chance to do it. Hopefully, we won't fail again. Congress must now respond. It is imperative that we restore the Voting Rights Act preclearance requirement, so it is to stay true to the Act's purpose of ensuring equal voting rights for all. John Lewis and many others risked their lives. John Lewis was beaten in the head, marching for voting rights in Selma, Alabama. Others were killed in Selma, and other places in the south looking for voting rights. Voting rights are so important, and we can't let those people's deaths, those people's injuries, those people's efforts go for naught. I thank our witnesses for being here. I look forward to their testimony. I now yield for the opening statement from the ranking member, the Honorable gentleman from Louisiana, Mr. Johnson. Mr. Johnson. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you all for being here for your interest today. I appreciate the opportunity to speak again on the duty and honor that Congress has to protect the fundamental right to vote in our country. All the sacrifices, the blood and the sweat and the tears that were put in by John Lewis and all those other legends and patriots and heroes will not be forgotten. While some have raised concerns regarding the Supreme Court's 2013 decision in Shelby County v. Holder, which struck down just one part of the Voting Rights Act, I would like to quote again from parts of that decision, because I think if we are going to talk about that decision today and its ramifications, it serves us well to articulate specifically what the Supreme Court actually said in that decision. I think the Court aptly described just how far this country has come. In its majority decision, the Court laid out the Constitutional infirmities of Section 4 of the VRA as follows, and I am just going to read you an important excerpt. Quote, ``The Framers of the Constitution intended the States to keep for themselves, as provided in the 10th Amendment, the power to regulate elections. Not only do States retain sovereignty under the Constitution, there is also a fundamental principal of equal sovereignty among the States. Indeed, the Constitutional equality of the States is essential to the harmonious operation of the scheme upon which the Republic was organized. Section 4 of the Voting Rights Act sharply departs from these basic principles. It suspends all changes to State election law, however innocuous, until they have been precleared by Federal authorities in Washington, D.C. In 1966, we found these departures from the basic features of our system of government justified. At the time, the coverage formula, the means of linking the exercise via unprecedented authority with the problem that warranted it, made sense. Nearly 50 years later, things have changed dramatically. In the covered jurisdictions, voter turnout and registration rates now approach parity. Blatantly discriminatory evasions of Federal decrees are rare, and minority candidates hold office at unprecedented levels. The tests and devices that blocked access to the ballot have been forbidden nationwide for more than 40 years. The 15th Amendment commands that the right to vote shall not be denied or abridged on account of race or color, and it gives Congress the power to enforce that command. The amendment is not designed to punish for the past. Its purpose is to ensure a better future. To serve that purpose, Congress, if it is to divide the States, must identify those jurisdictions to be singled out on the basis that makes sense in light of current conditions. It cannot rely simply on the past. Regardless of how to look at the record, however, no one can fairly say that it shows anything approaching the pervasive, flagrant, widespread, and rampant discrimination that faced Congress in 1965, and it clearly distinguished the covered jurisdictions from the rest of the Nation at that time. Our country has changed. And while any racial discrimination in voting is too much, Congress must ensure that the legislation it passes to remedy that problem speaks to current conditions,'' end of quote. That is what the Supreme Court said. And of course, I am sure everyone in this room agrees with those sentiments, and I have stated this before, Mr. Chairman, myself. At least some on this side agreed with what the Court said. Of course, we all agree that discriminatory treatment in voting based on race or sex is abhorrent. It is prohibited by the Constitution, as it should be. It is prohibited by Federal statue, as it should be. Regarding discriminatory treatment in voting that is based on race, Section 3 of the Voting Rights Act, which is permanent Federal statutory law, remains in place and full effect, as it should be. Several years ago, for example, U.S. District Judge Lee Rosenthal issued an opinion in a redistricting case that required the City of Pasadena, Texas, to be monitored by the Justice Department because it had intentionally changed its city council districts to decrease influence by citizens of Hispanic descent. The city, which the Court ruled, has a, quote, ``long history of discrimination against minorities,'' unquote, was required to have their future voting rules changes precleared by the Department of Justice for the next 6 years during which time the Federal judge, quote, ``retains jurisdiction to review before enforcement any change in the election map or plan that was in effect in Pasadena on December 1, 2013,'' unquote. A change to the city's election plan can be enforced without review by the judge only it if has been submitted to the U.S. Attorney General, and the Justice Department has not objected within 60 days. We support Section 3 in its application to proven instances of discriminatory treatment in voting, and I look forward to hearing from all of our witnesses here today. That testimony will include that of the Office of the Texas Attorney General, which I understand has argued in the Supreme Court 31 times since 2000, and they have either completely or substantially won the vast majority of those cases. The Texas Attorney General's Office has argued two of the most important VRA cases in recent memory, Evenwel and Perez, and won them both. In those decisions, Texas won a total of 13 votes at the Court for its position compared to just four votes against. This is an office with a proven track record of legal acumen and understanding confirmed at the highest levels, and by the U.S. Supreme Court itself. Thank you all, again, for your time and testimony. We look forward to hearing from you, and I yield back. Mr. Cohen. Thank you, Mr. Johnson. It is now my pleasure to recognize the chairman of the full committee, who was the chairman of this committee for many years, and today I will announce him as the chairman emeritus of this subcommittee, but the chairman, I guess, is emeritus of all committees. Mr. Nadler. Chairman Nadler. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. The Voting Rights Act of 1965 is one of the most effective civil rights statutes that has ever been enacted into law. Six years ago today, however, the Supreme Court issued its disastrous decision in Shelby County v. Holder, thereby effectively gutting one of the Act's central enforcement provisions known as the preclearance requirement, when it struck down as unconstitutional the Act's coverage formula, which determined which jurisdictions would be subject to the preclearance requirement. Section 5 of the Voting Rights Act contains a preclearance provision that requires certain jurisdictions with a history of discrimination to submit any changes to their voting laws or practices to the Department of Justice for prior approval to ensure that they are not discriminatory. To understand why the preclearance requirement was so central to enforcing the VRA, it is worth remembering why it was enacted in the first place. Before the Voting Rights Act, States and localities passed voter suppression laws, securing the knowledge that it could take many years before the laws could be successfully challenged in court, if at all. As soon as one law was overturned, another would be enacted, essentially setting up a discriminatory game of whack a mole. Section 5's preclearance provision broke this legal logjam and helped to stop this discriminatory practice. Indeed, the success of the Voting Rights Act with this effective preclearance requirement was apparent almost immediately after the law went into effect. For instance, registration of African Americans voters more than doubled in the south within just 4 years of enactment. Similarly, African American voter turnout rose from only 6 percent to 59 percent in just 4 years in Mississippi, and it soared to 92 percent in Tennessee, 77 percent in Arkansas, and 73 percent in Texas in that same period. The Voting Rights Act's success can also be measured in terms of the number of African Americans holding elected office, jumping from barely 100 prior to the VRA's enactment to more than 7,200 today, with 4,800 holding elected office in the south alone. Moreover, the number of African Americans in Congress doubled almost immediately after the Voting Rights Act was enacted; and today, there are 56 African American Members of Congress. And of course, in 2008, the country elected its first African American President. In short, the Voting Rights Act was an unqualified success, and much of that success can be attributed to the ability to enforce it vigorously. Central to the ability to enforce vigorously the Act was its preclearance provision. By striking down the formula for determining which States and localities are subject to the preclearance requirement, the Shelby County decision effectively suspended the operation of the preclearance requirement itself, and in its absence, the game of whack a mole has returned with a vengeance. Within 24 hours of the Shelby County decision, for example, the Texas Attorney General and North Carolina's General Assembly announced that they would reinstitute draconian voter ID laws. Both of these States' laws were later held in Federal courts to be intentionally, intentionally, racially discriminatory. But during the years between their enactment and the Court's final decision, many elections were conducted while the discriminatory laws remained in place. At least 21 other States have also enacted newly restrictive statewide voter laws since the Shelby County decision. Restoring the vitality of the Voting Rights Act is of critical importance. In 2006, when I was the ranking member of this subcommittee, we undertook an exhaustive process to build a record that demonstrated unequivocally the need to reauthorize the Voting Rights Act, provisions of which, like the preclearance requirement and the coverage formula that undergirded it, were expiring. At the time, the committee found that a majority of southern States were still engaged in ongoing discrimination. For instance, these States in the subdivisions engaged in racially discriminatory practices, such as relocating polling places for African Americans voters, and in the case of localities, annexing certain wards simply to satisfy white suburban voters who sought to circumvent the ability of African Americans to have a fair chance for elected office in their cities. Since the Shelby County decision, we have also seen the emergence of other voter suppression measures, like burdensome proof of citizenship laws, significant scale-backs to early voting periods, restrictions and absentee ballots, and laws that make it difficult to restore the voting rights of formerly incarcerated individuals. These kinds of voting practices have a disproportionate negative impact on minority voters. In the most recent elections in November of 2018, voters across the country encountered barriers to voting from State and local laws and circumstances that made it hard, or even impossible, to vote. For example, as our witness, Stacey Abrams, can attest to, in Georgia, 53,000 voter registrants, 70 percent of whom are African American, were replaced in pending status by the Secretary of State, who was also, by happenstance, Ms. Abrams' election opponent, because of minor misspellings on their registration forms. A Federal court ultimately put a stop to this practice on November 2, 2018, 4 days before the election, because of the, quote, ``differential treatment inflicted on a group of individuals who were predominantly minorities,'' closed quote. While it is true that those seeking to enforce the Voting Rights Act can still pursue after-the-fact legal remedies even without preclearance, time and experience have proven that such an approach takes far longer and is far more expensive than having an effective preclearance regime. And once the vote has been denied, it cannot be recast. The damage to our democracy is permanent. That is why I hope the members on both sides of the aisle and in both Chambers of Congress will come together and pass legislation to restore the Voting Rights Act to its full vitality. The Supreme Court left us instructions on how to enact a new Section 4 that would pass constitutional muster. Today's hearing will provide an important opportunity to renew our understanding of the importance of the Voting Rights Act and its preclearance provision, and to support our efforts to craft a legislative solution to restore, where needed, the preclearance provisions of the Voting Rights Act. I thank our witnesses, and I look forward to their testimony. Mr. Cohen. Thank you, Chairman Nadler. It is now my pleasure to recognize the ranking member of the full committee, the gentleman from Georgia, Mr. Collins, for his opening statement. Mr. Collins. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and it is good to be here, and it is good to have a hearing like this, if for no other reason, to at least correct the record and things that have already been said. Number one. In Georgia, the six counties mentioned, it is a reminder that in Georgia, all six of those counties are under local control on where they actually place their voting times-- their voting locations, how many they actually use, and that has been that way for a long time. We will get into more discussion about that. It is interesting that we also talk about scaling back early voting in others, because as we will find out in this hearing, myself and actually a witness here today, voted to scale back 3 weeks in Georgia, and add a Saturday. And at the time, it was actually attested to on many occasions that it showed no discriminatory impact. In fact, actually, some of what we found was actually helpful to minority turnout in that. So as we look at this, this is the reason to have a hearing, and I am glad to see friends and witnesses who are here today. But the right to vote is of paramount importance in a democracy. Its protection of discriminatory barriers has been grounded in Federal law since the Civil War, and more recently, through the Voting Rights Act of 1965. In 2013, the Supreme Court struck down a single part of the Voting Rights Act, Section 4. That provision automatically put certain States and political subdivisions under the Act's Section 5 preclearance requirements. Those preclearance requirements prevented voting rule changes in covered jurisdictions from going into effect until the new rules had been reviewed and approved, either following a lawsuit in the D.C. District Court, or by more often, the Department of Justice. When the Voting Rights Act was first enacted, Section 4 identified the jurisdictions automatically subject to the special preclearance requirements according to a formula. The first part of the formula provided a State or political subdivision would be covered if it maintained on November 1, 1964, a test or device restricting the opportunity to register and vote. The second piece provided a State or political subdivision would also be covered if the Census director determined that less than 50 percent of the persons of voting age were registered to vote on November 1, 1964, or less than 50 percent of the voting age voted in the 1964 presidential election. In its Shelby County decision, the Supreme Court struck down these automatic preclearance provisions, ruling the original coverage formula was, quote, ``based on decades-old data and eradicated practices.'' In 1965, the States could be divided into two groups, those with a recent history of voting test and low voter registration and turnout, and those without those characteristics. Congress based its coverage formula on that distinction. Today, we see a different place, and yet, the Voting Rights Act continued to treat it as if it were still in that time. The courts further criticized Section 4's formula as relying on decades-old irrelevant data to decades-old problems rather than current data reflecting current needs. In Shelby County, the Supreme Court only struck down that single, outdated provision of the VRA. Significantly, other very important provisions of the Voting Rights Act remain firmly in place, including Section 2 and Section 3. Section 2 applies nationwide, prohibits voting practices or procedures that discriminate on the basis of race, color, or the ability to speak English, like other Federal civil rights laws. Section 2 is enforced via Federal lawsuits. The United States and civil rights organizations have brought Section 2 cases in court, and still may do so in the future. Section 3 of the Voting Rights Act also remains in place, authorizing Federal courts to impose on States and political subdivisions that have enacted voting procedures treating people differently based on race in violation of the 14th and 15th amendments. If the court finds a State or political subdivision treated people differently based on race, the court has the discretion to retain supervisory jurisdiction and impose preclearance requirements on the State or political subdivision as the court sees fit until a future date. This means that a State or political subdivision would have to submit all future voting rules and changes for approval to either the court itself or the Department of Justice before enacting those changes. Per the Code of Federal Regulations, under Section 3(c) of the Voting Rights Act, a court in voting rights litigation can order, as relief, that a jurisdiction not subject to a preclearance requirement of Section 5 preclearance voting changes by submitting them to the court, or to the Attorney General. Americans continue to safeguard voting rights for every citizen. Increased voter turnout reflects that commitment. In my home State of Georgia, which has been mentioned many times already, and will probably be again, voter turnout has expanded mightily. Between 2014 and 2018, turnout among Hispanics and African American voters has soared, increasing by double digits in a State that more and more Americans are choosing to call home. I look forward to discussing more of that, and hearing that as we go forward, but also look forward to ensuring that the ballot box remains open to all eligible voters, and I am looking forward to this hearing. I appreciate the witnesses being here. I am sure this will be an interesting discussion in which hearings tend to set facts straight. And with that, I yield back. Mr. Cohen. Thank you, Mr. Collins. We welcome all of our witnesses. Thank you for your indulgence in allowing Ms. Clarke to testify and make her train. I explained to you about the lights: 4 minutes green, yellow, you have got a minute left. Red, you don't have to go to the train, but you have to stop. You are all under the statutes that say that if you say anything that is false in your testimony, perjury, you are subject to up to 5 years in prison or both for making such a statement, so all your written and oral statements to the subcommittee shall be truthful and honest. I am sure of that. Our first witness is Ms. Stacey Abrams. Ms. Abrams is the founder and chair of Fair Fight Action, an organization dedicated to advancing voting rights and electoral reform. In 2018, she was the Democratic nominee for Governor of the State of Georgia, the first African American woman in U.S. history nominated by a major party as its nominee for Governor. In that election, she received the highest voter turnout of any Democratic candidate in Georgia's history. Prior to running for Governor, she served in the Georgia General Assembly from 2007 to 2017, serving as the House minority leader from 2010 to 2017, and became the first woman to lead a party in the Georgia General Assembly, and the first African American leader of a party in the State House of Representatives. She received her J.D. degree from Yale Law School, and her Master of Public Affairs from the LBJ School of Public Affairs at the University of Texas at Austin, and her B.A., magnum cum laude, from Spelman College. Ms. Abrams, you are recognized for 5 minutes. We appreciate your attendance. STATEMENT OF HON. STACEY ABRAMS Ms. Abrams. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, Ranking Member Johnson, committee members. Thank you for allowing me to address this important hearing today. The Shelby decision created a new channel for the troubling practice of voter suppression during a time of dramatic demographic change. However, no assault on democracy will ever be limited to its targets. As the franchise is weakened, all citizens feel the effects, which is why restoration of the full power of the Voting Rights Act must occur. I come today because I was raised in Mississippi, where my parents joined the civil rights movement as teenagers, and they instilled in their six children a deep respect for the right to vote. I came of age in Georgia where I registered voters while in college, served as Georgia House minority leader, and where I stood for office as the Democratic nominee for Governor in 2018. Jurisdictions formerly covered under Section 5, joined now by States with changing demographics, have raced to reinstate, or create new hurdles to voter registration, ballot access, and ballot counting. Among the States, however, Georgia, has been one of the most aggressive in leveraging the lack of Federal oversight to use both law and policy to target voters of color. In 2014, I founded The New Georgia Project, one of the State's largest voter registration organizations. Minorities are twice as likely to register through third-party registration as are whites. Post Shelby, legislation and practices in States like Georgia, Tennessee, North Carolina, Texas, Wisconsin, and Florida, seek to impede these activities. Then-Georgia Secretary of State Brian Kemp, who was also responsible for the oversight of local elections officials, refused to take action to process registration forms in a timely manner. Later, we discovered unpublished internal rules, such as the 90-day blackout period during which no voter registration forms were processed, causing delays that denied registrants the right to vote. In 2017, citizens challenged and eliminated the secret policy through the Federal courts. Due to the volume of new Georgia Project registrations, which we tracked via paper ballots, we also proved the racially discriminatory effect of the exact match process which requires perfect data entry by government employees to secure a proper registration. In 2009, under preclearance requirements, the Justice Department summarily rejected exact match as presenting, quote, ``real, substantial, and retrogressive burdens on voters of color.'' Post Shelby, however, Mr. Kemp implemented the discredited exact match policies empowered by a lack of Justice Department preclearance. In 2016, Mr. Kemp agreed to process approximately 34,000 suspended applications. Despite this 2016 Federal settlement, Kemp ushered another iteration of exact match through the State legislature in 2017, leading to 53,000 suspended voter registrations in 2018, 70 percent of whom were black voters, who comprise roughly 30 percent of Georgia's eligible voters. Remaining on the voter rolls also poses challenges. Under Kemp's post-Shelby regime, facially neutral rules for removing voters who have died or left the State, became tools for voter purges. In total, he removed over 1.4 million voters from the rolls, including purging half a million voters in a single day in 2017, an 8 percent reduction in Georgia's voting population. An estimated 107,000 of these voters were removed through arguably unconstitutional application of the use-it-or-lose-it law. One of the most pernicious effects of Shelby can be found in the very act of casting a vote. Section 5 provided an effective check against hyperlocal suppressive tactics, like excessive poll closures, or challenge proceedings against voters of color as occurred in Georgia in 2015. Of 159 counties in Georgia, 156 counties removed the highest rate of voters from the rolls post Shelby, which resulted in an increase in the number of voter being forced to cast provisional ballots. Last election cycle, separate Federal courts ruled against Georgia policies for rejecting absentee ballots and valid applications under trivial pretenses for implementing an inconsistent provisional ballot system, and for improperly disallowing access to translators in the polling booths. While these lawsuits brought remedy to some, thousands more may have faced similar discrimination, without the resources or the knowledge to gain relief. Post Shelby voting rights groups must too often rely on resource-intensive litigation and advocacy work to protect the fundamental right to vote for voters of color. This anti-voting system has the concomitant effect of harming taxpayers as States must expend tax dollars to defend voter suppression in court. At the end of the 2018 contest, I acknowledged the legal result of an election marred by widespread election irregularities. I also redoubled my commitment to voting rights through the creation of Fair Fight Action, which has filed a federal lawsuit against the Georgia electoral system, asking for Georgia's preclearance requirement to be reinstated under Section 3. The proposed Voting Rights Advancement Act, and Voting Rights Amendment Act, represent considerable progress towards restoring the power of the Voting Rights Act, including modern-day protections that require nationwide preclearance to attack the broad reach of voter suppression. I strongly urge Congress to take action today, and I thank you for the opportunity to address this committee. [The statement of Ms. Abrams follows:] [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT] Mr. Cohen. Thank you very much, Ms. Abrams, and you were perfect on 5 minutes. Ms. Abrams. Not my first rodeo. Mr. Cohen. Not many people have been to a rodeo on this committee. You have not been a witness. Mr. Armstrong. I have been to a rodeo. Mr. Cohen. Okay. Good. Good. Good. Thank you. So have I. Mr. Kyle Hawkins, who has been to a rodeo, I presume, is the Solicitor General of Texas. He represents the State in high profile matters before the Federal and State appellate courts, including the Supreme Court of the United States. Mr. Hawkins previously practiced law in Washington, D.C. in the Dallas office of Gibson, Dunn & Crutcher, LLP, where he was a member of the appellate and constitutional law practice group. He also served as law clerk to the Honorable Samuel A. Alito, Jr., Associate Justice, United States Supreme Court, and the Honorable Edith Jones of the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Fifth Circuit. Mr. Hawkins is a summa cum laude graduate of the University of Minnesota Law School, and received his undergraduate degree, magna cum laude, from Harvard. You have been to a rodeo? Mr. Hawkins. I have been to many rodeos, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Cohen. Good. You are recognized for 5 minutes, sir. Thank you. STATEMENT OF HON. KYLE HAWKINS Mr. Hawkins. Chairman Cohen, Ranking Member Johnson, and members of the subcommittee, thank you very much for inviting me here today to testify about the Supreme Court's decision in Shelby County v. Holder. In Shelby County, the Supreme Court held that the coverage formula subjecting certain jurisdictions to preclearance under Section 5 of the Voting Rights Act was unconstitutional. When Congress enacted the Voting Rights Act of 1965, it imposed a novel restriction known as preclearance on various southern States and localities that shared two characteristics: the use of tests and devices for voter registration, and the voting rate in the 1964 presidential election at least 12 points below the national average. Congress tailored the original formula to include those States, because it found that widespread and persistent discrimination in voting in the early 1960s had typically entailed the misuse of test and devices, and this was the evil for which the remedies were specifically designed. The Supreme Court emphasized in Shelby County that the Constitution's allocation of power to the Federal Government and the States preserves the integrity, dignity, and residual sovereignty of the States. The Court explained that the Constitution also incorporates the fundamental principle of equal sovereignty among the States, and the powers reserved to the States by the Framers include broad authority over the conduct of elections. As the Supreme Court specifically noted in Shelby County, the Framers of the Constitution intended the States to keep for themselves as provided in the Tenth Amendment the power to regulate elections, that is, States have broad powers to determine the conditions under which the right of suffrage may be exercised. Preclearance under Section 5 of the Voting Rights Act is inconsistent with those central pillars of federalism because it forbids States to enforce their duly enacted voting laws until they secure permission from the Federal Government. Preclearance is thus an extraordinary measure that entails, as the Court put it in Shelby County, a drastic departure from the basic principles of federalism. So the real question at issue in Shelby County was whether the on-the-ground conditions were sufficient to justify that drastic departure. The Supreme Court squarely held no. Specifically, it held that preclearance must be reserved for extraordinary situations in which a jurisdiction is guilty of pervasive, flagrant, widespread, and rampant discrimination that cannot be remedied through normal litigation. That is, preclearance is justified only when the State is so determined to evade the commands of the 14th or 15th Amendments, that its citizens will be unable to protect their constitutional rights through traditional litigation under existing law. To be sure, the Supreme Court has recognized past situations sufficient to justify preclearance. The extraordinary burdens of a preclearance regime could be appropriate in a world in which aggrieved citizens are unable to use traditional litigation to secure relief against a State's flagrantly unconstitutional voting laws. In 1965, Congress found that those conditions existed in the States originally targeted by the preclearance regime, and the Supreme Court upheld that use of preclearance in the Katzenbach case. However, more than 50 years later, recent voting rights litigation in Texas shows that traditional litigation is more than adequate to identify and prevent violations of the Constitution and the Voting Rights Act. The courts have not hesitated to identify potential legal violations, and the Texas legislature has acted promptly to address them. For example, in litigation over Texas' voter identification law, the State agreed to a temporary remedial order to address a claim under Section 2 of the Voting Rights Act. In the next legislative session, the Texas legislature amended its voter identification law to incorporate the court-ordered remedy, which allows individuals who cannot secure a qualifying photo ID, to cast a regular in-person ballot by executing an affidavit at the polls. The Fifth Circuit later held that the amended statute provided an effective remedy for the only deficiencies testified to in the preexisting law. Those actions bear no resemblance to the conduct that justified preclearance in 1965, when officials in certain States routinely took steps to evade Federal court orders and prolong their resistance to the 15th Amendment. Rather than try to stay one step ahead of the courts in an effort to defy the Constitution, the State of Texas has followed the court's lead in an effort to conform its voting laws to the Constitution and the Voting Rights Act. Under governing Supreme Court authority, those conditions cannot justify preclearance. Thank you, again, for inviting me to testify. I look forward to your questions. [The statement of Mr. Hawkins follows:] [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT] Mr. Cohen. Thank you, sir. Our next witness is Ms. Leah Aden, Deputy Director of Litigation at the NAACP Legal Defense and Education Fund. She was a member of the Legal Defense Fund's litigation team in Shelby County v. Holder. Since that decision, she successfully led the Legal Defense Fund's efforts to block the implementation of discriminatory voting changes. She has also recently authored ``Democracy Diminished: State and Local Threats to Voting Post Shelby County, Alabama v. Holder,'' which details State, county, and local voting changes proposed or implemented during the more than 3 years since the Supreme Court decision in Shelby County, and continues to track post- Shelby County voting changes. She received her J.D. from Howard University School of Law and a B.A. in History and African American Studies from Columbia University, and also served as law clerk for the Honorable John T. Nixon, who is a friend of mine at the U.S. District Court of Appeals for the Middle District of Tennessee, a very great judge, unusual, and a wonderful human being. Ms. Aden, you are recognized for 5 minutes. STATEMENT OF LEAH C. ADEN Ms. Aden. Thank you. Good afternoon, Chairman Cohen, Ranking Member Johnson, and Chairman Nadler, and other members of the subcommittee. Again, my name is Leah Aden, and I am a Deputy Director of Litigation at the NAACP Legal Defense and Educational Fund. Thank you for the opportunity to share information about what LDF has observed regarding barriers to voting since the U.S. Supreme Court's 2013 decision in Shelby County, Alabama versus Holder. Since its founding in 1940 by Thurgood Marshall, LDF's mission is, and has always been, to promote racial justice and equality. Beginning with Smith v. Allwright, a case arising out of Texas, our successful Supreme Court case challenged the use of all whites primary elections in 1944. And since then, LDF has fought to overcome the myriad of obstacles put before black voters to ensure our full, equal, and active participation in American life. The right to vote for black people today, and for other people of color is facing its greatest threat in decades. As you know, the Shelby County decision invalidated the preclearance provision of Section 5 of the Voting Rights Act, removing the obligation of jurisdictions with a history and ongoing record of discrimination from submitting proposed voting changes to a Federal authority for approval. This process ensured that those changes would not discriminate against African American and other voters. The result of the Shelby decision was predictable. As Chairmen Cohen and Nadler have mentioned, within hours of the decision, the Texas Attorney General tweeted out his intention to implement a photo ID law that the State had been forbidden from implementing under Section 5. Other jurisdictions, including Alabama, followed suit. Even more alarming, voter suppression has metastasized in the years since the Shelby decision with places like Wisconsin, North Dakota, and jurisdictions in Kansas adopting laws and practices which result in voter suppression. Since the Shelby decision, LDF has tracked and recorded discriminatory voting changes in places previously protected by Section 5 that we can become aware of, and we do so in a regularly updated report, Democracy Diminished, and we have provided copies of this report to each member of this committee. Our documentation and examination of the plethora of discriminatory voting changes proposed or implemented since Shelby, our annual Election Day voter protection work, and our own experience litigating cases, challenging voter suppression schemes enables LDF to state, unequivocally, that there is a critical and urgent need for Congress to act to restore and strengthen the full protections of the Voting Rights Act. The genius of Congress' Section 5 preclearance mechanism is that it stopped discrimination before the harm occurred. While we still have Section 2, as you all have heard, that authorizes us to challenge discriminatory voting practices in Federal courts, it is not enough. Even when we are successful litigating these cases, the relief comes too late and at too great a cost in terms of time, money, and burden, for hundreds of thousands of voters. Millions. One case dramatically illustrates this. We successfully challenged Texas' voter ID law, judicially recognized as the most stringent voter ID law in the country. The trial court found that the law violated Section 2's results test and was enacted intentionally to discriminate against African American and Latino voters. We proved at trial that more than a half million registered voters, and up to a million eligible voters were disenfranchised by the ID law. The Fifth Circuit Court of Appeals affirmed that the law violated the Voting Rights Act. But during the 3 years in which we litigated the case through trial, and before voters received relief, Texas elected a U.S. Senator, all 36 members of the Texas delegation to the U.S. House of Representatives, a Governor, a Lieutenant Governor, Attorney General, Controller, all 150 Members of the State house, over 175 trial court judges, and over 75 District Attorneys. Relief simply was too late for voters across all of those elections. Since Shelby, Federal courts have found that officials in five different States have passed racially discriminatory voting laws, intentionally for the purpose of discriminating against black and Latino voters. Ms. Clarke mentioned the North Carolina case. There is a voter suppression crisis in our country, and Congress has an obligation to use the enforcement powers it was bestowed in the 14th and 15th Amendment to the U.S. Constitution, to amend the Voting Rights Act to protect minority voters from racially discriminatory voting schemes. The Supreme Court, in Shelby, rejected Congress' determination, despite the extensive record that Congress amassed that the preclearance process was necessary. The court, in particular, as you have heard, objected to what it regarded as a targeting of mostly southern States. I agree with you, Chairman Cohen, that Congress got it wrong in Shelby, and substituted its own judgment for Congress, but the Shelby decision is the law, and any effort by this body to amended the Voting Rights Act must be undertaken with attention to the court's guidance in that case. H.R. 4 does precisely that. It proposes a nationwide formula without geographic limitation that will require any jurisdiction that engages in systematic discrimination to submit voting changes to a Federal authority for preclearance. And I look forward to hearing your questions and being able to answer them. [The statement of Ms. Aden follows:] [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT] Mr. Cohen. Thank you. And I will proceed first with the 5- minute rule and recognize myself. First, in your statement, I believe you said the court had it--Congress had it wrong and the court had it right. Is that what--did I hear it wrong, or did you say it wrong? Ms. Aden. If I misstate, misspoke, I definitely mean that Congress had it absolutely right, and the Supreme Court had it wrong. Mr. Cohen. I thought that is what it was. Yeah. Congress finally got it right. Ms. Aden. And they got it right on multiple times over multiplied decades under different administrations. Mr. Cohen. Right after the Holder case, Texas had a photo ID law. Ms. Aden, do you know what happened with the attack on that law and what the Supreme Court--what the courts ruled in those voter ID? Ms. Aden. I know it quite well, because I am part of the team among many members who have been litigating that case now for 7 or 8 years. So we have to step back and also remember that the Texas photo ID law, which has been recognized as the strictest in the Nation at one time, was adopted in the context of a legislature that had also adopted racially discriminatory voting plans that had been found to be intentionally discriminatory for the State House and for Congress. That same body, post 2010, adopted a strict photo ID law, and it was blocked by Section 5, because the record then, as the record came to show after trial and after several appeals, prohibited up to 600,000 registered Texas voters, and up to 1 million eligible voters to vote. This was a law that was crafted to allow people with handgun licenses disproportionately held by white voters, to vote, but student IDs, tribal IDs, Native American tribal IDs, Federal and State employee IDs were carved out of that law, so that people could not participate in the political process. We went to trial in 2014, and the Court found that the law violated the results test of Section 2, and also violated various provisions of the U.S. Constitution. That case went up, and the en banc court of the Fifth Circuit confirmed that that law, and by ``en banc,'' I mean the full panel of the Fifth Circuit affirmed that that law has discriminatory results. And our position is that the--and subsequently, remanded the case. There was an interim remedy. Well, frankly, Texas had to be forced to come up with a remedy for voting--for its discriminatory photo ID law. They had to be forced after they were told by Section 5, after people provided testimony before them, that the law was discriminatory, they had to be forced into an interim remedy. That interim remedy was subsequently upheld by another three-judge panel of the Fifth Circuit. Frankly, our position is that that decision did not disturb the intent ruling. Mr. Cohen. Was that remedy that possibly the law that Mr. Hawkins said was passed---- Ms. Aden. Yeah, and that is part of---- Mr. Cohen [continuing]. But was that after an election had taken place? Ms. Aden. That was after many elections. Mr. Cohen. So what remedy was available to those voters who were affected by a law that the court said was discriminatory? Ms. Aden. Absolutely none. Millions, if not hundreds of thousands of votes were lost after---- Mr. Cohen. So it is not a rodeo, but the cattle are out of the barn. They have gone. There is nothing you can do at that point. Ms. Aden. They are over. People have been elected. That was genius behind Section 5, that Congress understood that elections would take place, and we need to block harm before elections take place, before the cancer of racial discrimination takes root, before people get the benefit of discrimination, and the victims of discrimination have to then race into court at the cost of hundreds of thousand, if not millions of dollars, to uproot discrimination. Mr. Cohen. Thank you so much. Ms. Abrams, Mr. Hawkins said in his written testimony that the current conditions in terms of voting rights aren't so bad, that we have really done a great job, and it is not like 1965, and we are just doing wonderful, good things, in essence, and the preclearance requirement is not necessary. In other words, he thinks the Supreme Court got it right in Shelby when he concluded that Congress exceeded its constitutional authority to impose preclearance requirements on certain States and localities. This is federalism, but sometimes the States go too far, and they interfere with the Federal statutes or Federal constitutional privileges, and then the Feds have to come in. What do you think about Mr. Hawkins' position that we don't need the preclearance requirement anymore? Ms. Abrams. I vehemently disagree. I grew up in Mississippi, I live in Georgia, and I recently went through a fairly public display of the need for preclearance. Mr. Kemp, the current Governor, then Secretary of State, had been denied the ability to impose the exact match policy under preclearance. The moment Shelby was passed, he reinstituted this policy. In 2016, he had to enter into a Federal settlement, because 34,000 voters were denied the right to vote in an election cycle; in fact, over two elections cycles. He agreed to the settlement in 2016, and the very next year, ushered through a different iteration of the exact same discriminatory policy. And in 2018, a third court told him to stop it because--sorry, a second court, because 53,000 voters were suspended from being able to register to vote. That is a small kernel of an example. The State of Georgia has found itself in multiple lawsuits where upon adjudication, the State has been told that their actions were racially discriminatory. That means that people have been denied the right to vote. They will never be able to unring that bell. And I believe that preclearance--in fact, we know empirically that preclearance would have permitted more voters to cast their ballots because the policies that denied them the right to vote would not have been enacted. Mr. Cohen. Thank you. And I just have to say, because it is one of the things I think about a lot. You said you are from Mississippi, and I want to say some nice things about Nina Simone. Ms. Abrams. Thank you. Mr. Cohen. You are welcome. Mr. Johnson, you are recognized. Mr. Johnson. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Hawkins, Texas has been evoked a number of times today, and at the outset, let me just ask you: Is there anything that has been said here today or submitted in the written record that you would like to respond to as Solicitor General of that State? Mr. Hawkins. Yes, Representative. I would like to do that. Thank you for the opportunity. There has been a lot said about the Texas voter ID law and litigation, and I would like to set the record straight on that. First, no District Court has ever found that any number of voters were disenfranchised. The Fifth Circuit found that 95 percent of Texas voters already had a qualifying photo ID, and the ones who didn't could simply get a qualifying photo ID to comply with that law, which, by the way, has been supplanted by new legislation and is now obsolete. That is not disenfranchisement under any reasonable definition. In any event, the notion that minority voters were targeted by the voter ID law was contradicted by the plaintiff's own expert witness, who offered data showing that the small percentage of Texans who did not already have a qualifying photo ID, the majority of them were white voters. I would also like to speak to the importance of voter ID set against the context of Supreme Court precedent. The Supreme Court held, in Crawford v. Marion County, that voter ID laws serve the legitimate State interest of protecting the integrity and reliability of the electoral process and increasing public confidence in elections. As former President Jimmy Carter once explained, the electoral system cannot inspire public confidence if no safeguards exist to deter or detect fraud, or to confirm the identity of voters. The Texas legislature studied this issue and concluded that in-person voter fraud is a problem. The legislature concluded in reliance on Crawford, and on the Carter Baker report, that a photo ID requirement would help combat in-person voter fraud. Furthermore, voter ID is a key method for detecting in-person voter fraud. It is very hard to spot in-person voter fraud absent a photo ID requirement. Finally, I think the Supreme Court's decision in Purcell v. Gonzalez, is very instructive on this point, and I would like to briefly read the key portion of the Supreme Court's binding analysis: ``A State indisputably has a compelling interest in preserving the integrity of its election process. Confidence in the integrity of our electoral processes is essential to the functioning of our participatory democracy. Voter fraud drives honest citizens out of the democratic process and breeds distrust of our government. Voters who fear their legitimate votes will be outweighed by fraudulent ones will feel disenfranchised. The right of suffrage can be denied by a debasement or dilution of the weight of a citizen's vote just as effectively as by wholly prohibiting the free exercise of the franchise.'' That is a quote from Purcell v. Gonzalez. Just a couple of other points on the voter ID litigation. There were 14 individual plaintiffs in that case, and the evidence showed that not a single one of those plaintiffs had been disenfranchised. Nine of them were eligible to vote by mail without a photo ID. Three had a compliant ID. One chose to get a California ID instead of a Texas ID, and one had the documents that were necessary to get an ID. Finally, voter turnout was unaffected in the elections following the implementation of S. 14, which was the voter ID law at issue there. As I indicated, the Texas legislature passed a new voter ID law, S. 5. That is now law in Texas. It has not been challenged. Mr. Johnson. Thank you for clarifying the record. That is important today. Could you walk us through how a generic case could be brought under Section 3 of the Voting Rights Act? In other words, in what steps would it proceed? Mr. Hawkins. Yes, Representative. I would be happy to do that. That raises an important point that Section 2 and Section 3 of the Voting Rights Act remain fully intact notwithstanding the Supreme Court's decision in Shelby County. I believe all of the witnesses before the subcommittee today agree on that point. When somebody believes that they are the victim of intentional discrimination, they can bring an action under the Voting Rights Act Section 2. And if, indeed, the conditions are those that resemble the conditions in 1965 that justified preclearance in the first place, Section 3(c) provides a remedy to address that called the bail in process. The bail in process is like a targeted form of preclearance. It can be set for a certain amount of time, it can cover certain areas. It is a surgical ability to impose a type of preclearance regime on a locality that truly demonstrates the same conditions that existed in the early 1960s that justified preclearance in the first place. Those two parts of the Voting Rights Act are still very much in place. They are being litigated to this day, notwithstanding Shelby County 6 years ago which had nothing to do with those provisions. Mr. Johnson. I am out of time. I appreciate all of you. I yield back. Mr. Cohen. Thank you, sir. I now recognize Mr. Nadler for 5 minutes. Chairman Nadler. Thank you. Ms. Abrams, as we have in numerous cases, challenging discriminatory voting laws since the Shelby County decision, litigation takes years to resolve and can cost millions of dollars to completion. Moreover, discrimination victims can initiate such litigation only after they have been harmed. Even while litigation is ongoing, States that continue to advance more restrictions on the right to vote. In a world that is effectively without a preclearance requirement, how has the cost and length of private litigation impacted the ability of civil rights groups to protect voters? Ms. Abrams. It is a crippling burden that has been placed on organizations that have to seek outside financial support in order to secure fundamentally guaranteed rights to vote. My organization, The New Georgia Project, which we founded in 2014, had to pursue years of litigation to undo some of the challenges we discovered. As I mentioned earlier, the exact match process only came to light because of the 34,000 applications that were suspended. And under a settlement in 2016, 2 years after the initial election, Secretary Kemp then agreed to restore their right to vote. We had a 90-day rule, which created a blackout period during which thousands of applications to register to vote were not processed, which meant that at least 20,000 that we know of were held up until after the election. They were not timely processed because of an unwritten rule, that had preclearance been in effect, would have come to light. It took us 2\1/2\ years of litigation and discovery for us to discover this problem. And in 2017, 3 years after we uncovered this issue, they finally had a Federal court to essentially eliminate the ability to use this 90-day suspension rule. These are only two examples of what has hit organizations, is that they are being forced to combat massive State budgets that allow taxpayers to fund voter suppression until such time as those who are most vulnerable and most harmed can muster the resources to defend themselves and to restore the right to vote. Chairman Nadler. Thank you. Ms. Aden, Mr. Hawkins argues that Congress must identify congruent and proportional constitutional violations. Specifically, that any State subjected to preclearance has engaged in rampant, widespread, recalcitrant discrimination so pervasive that it cannot be adequately addressed by judicial remedies, in order to constitutionally justify imposing substantial federalism costs for the preclearance requirement. He also asserts that based on current facts, Congress could not meet such a standard and, therefore, may exceed its authority under the 15th Amendment if we now impose a preclearance requirement. How would you respond to that? Ms. Aden. Thank you for that question. So I agree that Section 5 is meant to get at the whack a mole, the adaptive discrimination, but I do adamantly disagree that we have to demonstrate that conditions existed like they were in 1965 or before then, because Congress surmised with the evidence before it that discrimination is ingenious, that it morphs into the next bad thing. And I think it is important that we also talk and continue to look at Texas, because the record there is one of many that shows the pervasiveness of discrimination. The Fifth Circuit has ruled on the Texas voter ID law, and the merits of that case have been decided, so I am not going to continue to dispute that the Fifth Circuit has determined that the law was racially discriminatory. But then we can look to what, again, the legislature did with its redistricting plans. They had found 2011 Congressional and State House plans had been determined to be intentionally discriminatory, and I heard members of the commission say that is abhorrent, that intentional discrimination is abhorrent. We have seen abhorrent behavior in Texas. And if you look not just at its ID law, but if you look at the redistricting plans, you can look at the intentional discrimination found by a District Court in Pasadena where the Federal court has ordered that jurisdiction to be subject to bail in. You can see what Waller County has done, decade after decade, trying to discriminate against historically black students at Prairie View and AMU. You can see what the legislature tried to do this last session with S.B. 9 trying to put through an omnibus voter suppression bill. I mean, you can look at that one jurisdiction, and Ms. Abrams can talk in detail about Georgia, and we can look across the country, and that record exists. Chairman Nadler. Thank you. Ms. Aden. Yes. Chairman Nadler. Thank you. I have one more question---- Ms. Aden. Yes. Chairman Nadler [continuing]. Before we run out of time. Should the Department of Justice, or perhaps the court, be granted, in a new Voting Rights Act jurisdiction, to retroactively invalidate an election and order a new election when it is proven that there was substantial discrimination that exceeds the margin of victory of a candidate? Ms. Aden. You know, before answering that directly, Congress is operating at the apex of its power by enforcing the 14th and 15th Amendments. And what we saw during the Section 5, nearly 50 years of Section 5 operating, is that it was necessary on certain occasions to invalidate elections. In fact, the case that came to the Supreme Court in Shelby County was the result of white voters, someone mentioned annexations, annexing black voters out of a district. It went from being 80 percent black to under 30 percent black in a majority black district, and those annexations over time weren't precleared. Ultimately, the law required that an election be held under a fair electoral system. And so, I do think that that is more the exception than the rule, and that we need to think about going forward what mechanism do we have in place so that people don't have to marshal the resources to run into court. Congress should also look at strengthening the preliminary injunction standard, because that is another thing that makes it very difficult for the victims of discrimination to be able to stop discrimination before it happens. But to your question, I do think there are exceptional circumstances where redoing an election when there has been a racially discriminatory, abhorrent practice is something that can take place, but we need a mechanism where no election takes place under a racially discriminatory regime. Chairman Nadler. Thank you. My time has expired. I yield back. Mr. Cohen. Thank you, Mr. Chair. I now recognize Mr. Cline, the distinguished member from the far western part of Virginia. Mr. Cline. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I thank the witnesses for being here. In 1965, Congress enacted the Voting Rights Act to address deep-rooted racial discrimination in voting. The Voting Rights Act was the most significant statutory change since the Reconstruction period following the Civil War and the relationship between State governments and the Federal Government in terms of voting, and it was immediately challenged in the courts. Between 1965 and 1969, the Supreme Court issued several key decisions upholding the constitutionality of Section 5, and affirming the broad range of voting practices for which preclearance was required. Now we have the decision in Shelby where the court ruled Section 4(b) is unconstitutional because it covers formulas based on data over 40 years old, thereby making it no longer responsive to current needs and an impermissible burden on the constitutional principles of federalism that equals sovereignty of the States. The Supreme Court decision in Shelby is now considered a landmark case regarding the constitutionality of the Voting Rights Act, and with many questions remaining, I am happy to have this hearing to discuss the impact of Shelby. I would first--well, let me first ask Mr. Hawkins if there is anything he would like to respond to that was said. Mr. Hawkins. Thank you, Representative. Just a couple of things in response. My colleagues have referred to purposeful discrimination findings made by District Courts. Not a single one of them has survived appeal. In the voter ID case, for example, the court, the Fifth Circuit explicitly vacated and reversed the District Court's purposeful discrimination finding in that case. All other findings have met the same fates. As to the claim that Texas' behavior demonstrates a need for preclearance, I think the opposite is true. What we have seen in the redistricting case in the voting rights, or the voter ID case that we have been talking about today, is Texas has responded to that litigation by working to conform its laws to the requirements of the Voting Rights Act, and the requirements of the Constitution. As I discussed earlier, when Texas' voting rights--or excuse me--voter ID law was challenged, S.B. 14, rather than pursue another appeal to the Supreme Court following the en banc vote, Texas changed its law. Likewise, in the redistricting case, in redistricting litigation following the 2010 Census, a Federal District Court ordered interim remedial redistricting plans into effect, because the legislatively enacted plans had not been precleared. Consistent with the Supreme Court's instructions in Perez v. Perry, the District Court conducted only a preliminary view of claims against the State's plans, but the court-ordered interim plans made extensive changes. The Texas legislature repealed its challenged plans and permanently adopted the court-ordered plans in its next session. So what we have seen in the case of Texas is a State conforming its laws to the requirements of the Constitution, the Voting Rights Act, and the Supreme Court. That is a far cry from the landscape in 1965 when the covered jurisdictions were deliberately acting in bad faith to evade the review of the Supreme Court, forestall their compliance with the 15th Amendment, and suppress voters illegally. Mr. Cline. In fact, that is federalism at work, is it not, the States responding to the court's direction with affirmative legislative action? Mr. Hawkins. It is, Representative, and that is one of the Supreme Court's core themes in the Shelby County decision. The States created the Federal Government. In no other context do States have to run their laws by the Federal Government to get permission in advance of enforcing them. The preclearance regime that the Voting Rights Act created was the one exception to that general rule, and it was justified only by the extreme conditions on the ground in the south in the early 1960s. That is the core holding of the Supreme Court's Shelby County decision. Absent those extreme concerns, federalism and the co-equal sovereignty of the States does not allow Congress to impose that type of regime, and that is the core holding of Shelby County in 2013. Mr. Cline. In fact, laws such as regular maintenance of voter rolls and photo ID laws are commonplace among States at this point, correct? Mr. Hawkins. Absolutely, Representative. There is nothing unusual or noteworthy about a State auditing its voter rolls to ensure that only eligible voters are registered to vote. In fact, I have just seen in the news this week reports that California is looking at its own voter rolls to ensure that only eligible voters are registered. The coverage I have seen indicated that in Los Angeles County, there are far more registered voters than there are eligible voters, and I understand that jurisdiction is taking a look at that to figure out what is going on. States and counties do this all the time. They have an obligation to do so consistent with Federal law to ensure that only eligible voters are voting. Mr. Cline. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I yield back. Mr. Cohen. Thank you, Mr. Cline. Mr. Raskin is recognized for 5 minutes. Mr. Raskin. Mr. Chairman, thank you. The States did not create the Union. We, the people, created the Union in the Constitution. That is what we fought the Civil War about. It was the claim of the confederacy that it was a handshake among the States, and Lincoln explicitly rejected that and said the people created the Union and the Constitution, and no State could opt out of it. No State could secede, so I think we settled that question a century and a half ago. Disenfranchisement used to be relatively simple. In the first century, the law simply said that African Americans couldn't vote. Before the Civil War, the States just made it plain that--then we had a Civil War. We passed the 13th and 14th and 15th Amendments, which established that the States could not discriminate on the basis of race, and for a period, the Constitution worked. That was Reconstruction, and we had African Americans voting in huge numbers throughout the former confederacy and African Americans getting elected to high offices in the States and getting elected to this body. And then there was a savage assault on Reconstruction. Some of it was through violence led by the KKK, and the former confederates. But a long period of subtle, legal disenfranchisement began with literacy tests, poll taxes, grandfather clauses, white primaries, character exams. And the second Reconstruction, which was the modern civil rights movement, targeted all of those practices with the Voting Rights Act of 1965, and specifically, with Section 5, which Ms. Aden has elaborated so well here. It said before the States that engaged in massive disenfranchisement and extinguishment of people's political rights for decades could make changes to voting practices, they had to first go to the Department of Justice, or to the U.S. District Court for the District of Columbia. Because if we allow them to go ahead and impose another disenfranchising mechanism, and they finally get to court 6 months or 8 months or 12 months later, it is too late to do anything. It is meaningless. That is what Section 5 and the preclearance requirement is all about. Now, we are living in a period where there is an attack on the second Reconstruction, on the modern civil rights movement and the Voting Rights Act, and we got it from a gerrymandered conservative Supreme Court in 2013 in Shelby County v. Holder, which basically decapitated the Voting Rights Act in Shelby County v. Holder. Now, Ms. Abrams, it is an honor to have you here before the House Judiciary Committee. I heard you mention a bunch of new techniques of disfranchisement, voter purges, 90-day blackout period, refusing to process voter registration, exact match process. Can you tell me quickly what are the one or two worst techniques that were used in Georgia that disfranchised the people of the State in the last election? Ms. Abrams. Certainly. Thank you for the question. Exact match, I think, is the most obvious and deliberate and the strongest proof point for the need for preclearance, because it was denied under preclearance and only existed because preclearance disappeared. Mr. Raskin. Will you explain just very briefly again what exact match is? Ms. Abrams. Exact match requires perfect data entry by government employees. When you submit your application, if there is a hyphen missing, if your last name is spelled with a space, and they decline to enter the space, your application can be rejected. And in Georgia's system, there is no notice to the applicant of what the problem is. So you receive this circular firing squad of receiving information that you have been rejected. You resubmit the information. Likely, the government employee resubmits it the way they typed it the first time, and you never know that the reason you were rejected was a typographical error. Mr. Raskin. Very good. Thank you very much. Let's see. Mr. Hawkins, let me come to you. Texas put out a voting advisory in January that alleged that as many as 95,000 non- citizens were on the Texas voter rolls. This advisory fell apart within days because it became clear that tens of thousands of people on the State's list were actually U.S. citizens and were wrongfully included on this list. The State pulled the advisory back in April in order to resolve multiple Federal lawsuits that were brought against it. Now, had Texas counties moved forward with removing people from the rolls based on this flawed advisory, Texas would have disenfranchised thousands of people, and yet, presumably, you would be here to say that that is not something that should have had to go through the preclearance process, and if it had happened, they could have sued later. What would you have said to the thousands of people who had been disenfranchised under that situation? Mr. Hawkins. Representative, thank you for bringing up that example. I would like to address the premise of that question. The bottom line is that not a single person had his voter registration cancelled, not a single---- Mr. Raskin. Because of the lawsuits that were brought against it, right? Mr. Hawkins. Because Texas did the right thing. There was an error, a miscommunication between the Texas Department of Public Safety based on incorrect---- Mr. Raskin. I guess that is the whole point here. Who should bear the burden of the errors of the State? Should it be the people of the State who are trying to vote, or should it be the government officials who should get their hands slapped in a preclearance investigation by the Department of Justice? Mr. Hawkins. Your Honor, I--or excuse me. Representative, I don't think---- Mr. Raskin. That is fine. Mr. Hawkins. I don't think that the experience that you are referring to implicates that question. The Secretary of State does not have the power to remove individuals from the voting rolls. County officials are responsible for maintaining the voting rolls in each county, and those county officials may remove a voter from the voting rolls only after a number of safeguards have been satisfied, including post removal judicial review, which is very much a part of the process. Mr. Raskin. Well, let me ask you this. Mr. Cohen. Your time is over by a minute. Thank you, Mr. Raskin. Mr. Raskin. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Cohen. Do you have to leave for the airport? Mr. Hawkins. Yes, Mr. Chairman. I have got a flight back. Mr. Cohen. I am just going to ask you for the heck of it. What time is your--when does your flight leave? Mr. Hawkins. My flight leaves at, I believe, 5:50. Mr. Cohen. You can make it in plenty of time. I don't want to stop you. But Ms. Abrams' flight is at what, 5:15? Ms. Abrams. 5:40. Mr. Cohen. 5:40. Mr. Raskin. You guys can share a taxicab. Mr. Cohen. We have got three more people, which is 15 minutes. Can you wait 15 minutes? You will make it, believe me. I leave in an hour, and I make it. Mr. Hawkins. Understood, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Cohen. All right. Let's go. 5 minutes on the nose. Ms. Garcia, you are on. Ms. Garcia. I will dispense with any preliminary remarks. I just want to dive into the comment you just made in response to my colleague, Mr. Raskin. I mean, I just am sitting here in disbelief that you are suggesting that Texas did the right thing in this whole purging order of these 95,000 registered voters. I mean, the Secretary of State's office and the Governor and it seems like everyone up in Austin was suggesting that this was not happening, that it was really, you know, something that they didn't mean to do. I mean, it took almost 5 months, and the entire Senate not voting for the Secretary of State which he still did not get confirmed. And to have you sit here now and say that they were doing the right thing just as you are suggesting that Texas always is taking the lead, I am telling you. I was there sitting in the Texas Senate when we voted on the agreement on the Voting Rights Act--I mean, Voter ID. We were not taking the lead. I did not like some of it. I thought it wasn't good enough, but we were pretty much forced to do it because of the pending Federal court case. So I just want to clarify the record that some of the statements that you are making are, quite frankly, quite misleading, and I take offense to some of them and the characterizations that you have made. But having said that, because I said I was not going to make a preliminary remark, Texas is really almost the poster child for Voting Rights Act violations. I testified before the Senate Judiciary Committee back in 2014, and as I reflected on the testimony I presented there then, not much has changed. When I testified back in 2014, between 1982 and 2005, for example, Texas had earned 107 Section 5 objections to voting policy, second only in number to Mississippi; 97 concerned local laws and affected about 30 percent of Texas counties home to disproportionate share, nearly 72 percent of the State's non-voting population. And it is true, Ms. Aden. How many times have Federal courts found intentional intent discrimination? Is it seven, eight? I have lost track. Ms. Aden. Across five States, there are about 9 decisions of intentional discrimination since Shelby. Ms. Garcia. Since Shelby. And how many of those have been vacated completely, and not sent down for rehearing and another trial? Ms. Aden. I believe all of the nine across those five States are still standing decisions of intentional discrimination under the Constitution. Ms. Garcia. Right. They are still standing. Now, which one of our redistricting maps are we working under? Is it not true that most--we are still under the temporary maps because we are still in litigation since the last Census? Ms. Aden. So the two--there are decisions from after-- decisions related to the 2011 maps that forced the interim plans that were, in large part, upheld by the Supreme Court, but those early decisions that led to the interim remedy, those were based upon findings, preliminary findings of intentional discrimination, and those have not been disturbed. When this case eventually made it to the Supreme Court, while an entire decade had passed and many elections had taken place, the Supreme Court upheld the discrimination in one district. So it is a very complicated posture, but our position is that there are intentional discrimination rulings from 2011. That is the basis for the bail in relief that advocates are still continuing to urge in District Courts in Texas. And Texas represents--it is the poster child, but there is also evidence from many other States that this body should examine that warrants Section 5 preclearance. Ms. Garcia. But the only one where we have a bail-in provision would be the Pasadena case which actually you said in my district, in working together with MALDEF, we were able to litigate that. In fact, I testified about Pasadena at the Senate Judiciary Committee in the Galveston County case. It just seems like a lot of that, because my district is 77 percent Latino, and that is where a lot of stuff happens. Ms. Aden. And I would just correct you. That was the only court-ordered bail in Pasadena. Since Shelby, Allen Evergreen, Alabama, a court found intentional discrimination, and the parties agreed to bail-in, so there two jurisdictions that since Shelby have been subject to bail-in, but that is far insufficient. Ms. Garcia. I am almost losing my time here, but just one quick question. On this, Section 5 was meant to, as you said, to get to the harm before it starts. How much does this litigation cost? I mean, some of these cases go on 5, 6, 7 years. Just ballpark figure. I know every case is different, but just generally speaking, how much do we have to spend on this? Ms. Aden. On average, hundreds of thousands of dollars, if not millions, and that includes not just challenges to statewide measures, but even suing one county can cost hundreds of thousands, if not millions of dollars, and that is both taxpayers' money to fight discrimination, and that is taxpayer money drawn by the discriminators to defend discrimination. Ms. Garcia. Thank you. And Mr. Chairman, I would like to ask unanimous consent to enter into the record the entire 20 some pages---- Mr. Cohen. Without objection, it will be done. [The information follows:] ======================================================================= _______________________________________________________________________ MS. GARCIA FOR THE OFFICIAL RECORD ======================================================================= [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT] Mr. Cohen. Ms. Escobar for 5 minutes. Ms. Escobar. Chairman Cohen, thank you so much for holding this hearing, especially on this very important anniversary, and thanks to all of our panelists for being here. I am very grateful for your testimony. Although I will say I am shocked to hear the opinion that Texas has done the right thing when it comes to its voter suppression efforts, because we all know that the consequences to voter suppression completely change the outcome of elections and change the public's ability to have true representation in public office. Mr. Chairman, I would like to please enter into the record an article about my Governor, who is reportedly--emails show he is behind the effort to purge the voter rolls in Texas, an effort that many of us saw as a surreptitious way to change the outcome of elections, and to try to circumvent the changing demographics in our State. Mr. Cohen. Without objection, it will be done. [The information follows:] ======================================================================= _______________________________________________________________________ MS. ESCOBAR FOR THE OFFICIAL RECORD ======================================================================= [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT] Ms. Escobar. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Ms. Abrams, you and I share the fact that we both come from a State that--States, Texas and Georgia, that were previously covered under the preclearance formula. In your testimony, you illustrate the challenges Georgia faces in a post Shelby world, and I see so many parallels between our two States, given the example that I just cited. Can you please expand on the voter roll purges in Georgia? What are some of the key lessons that you learned that you can share with us through your work with The New Georgia Project and Fair Fight Action? What can Texas learn from Georgia? Ms. Abrams. I am going to decline to answer that question, but I will answer the larger question. I would say, first of all, during the tenure of Secretary of State Brian Kemp, 1.4 million voters were purged. In a single day in 2017, half a million voters were taken off the roll, a reduction of the Georgia rolls by 8 percent. Now, to the credit of the State, we have a version of automatic registration, which has added about 681,000 voters to the rolls, simply by signing up for their driver's license. The challenge is that a number of those people who are availing themselves of that were unlawfully purged during the 1.4 million-person purge. The challenge is that in Georgia, we face not only malfeasance, but incompetence. There are people being removed from the rolls who should not be removed. There is no condition for their removal, but we have been able to demonstrate that the communication from the Secretary of State's office has been inadequate to the task. There has been a constant attempt to defer responsibility to the localities to say that it was the county's fault for not doing so, but the reality is the Secretary of State is the election superintendent. That is the person in charge. The buck stops with that person. And the challenge with the way voter purging happens is that no one is responsible, but voters are losing their rights. In the State of Georgia, there has been an argument that because we had the highest turnout record in Georgia for voter turnout in 2018, there could not have been voter suppression. I would argue that that is the moral equivalent of saying that because more people get in the water, there can't be sharks. The reality is that voter suppression is adapting to the changing demographics of our country, and the reality is that voter purging is one of the tools used. It may be an imperfect tool, because people will continue to seek their rights. They believe that they have the right to vote. I grew up with parents who instilled in me a respect for that right, and there are those who will aggressively and assiduously pursue it, but there are so many others, who when rejected by their State, when rejected by their government, they turn away, and they do not return. And that is what is so pernicious about voter suppression, that we have people who believe now that they have no voice because of error, because of intentionality, and because of racial discrimination. And those are challenges that not only affect Georgia, but they affect the rest of the country. One thing I will say is that I do believe that one of the opportunities we have here is to expand the coverage of Section 5. I do believe that there is a broader need for Section 5 to not simply be afforded or to provide coverage to those States that have a history of bad action, because the reality is more States have joined the party. More States have decided that because they cannot win elections fairly if there is full participation, then the goal is to limit who can participate. And that is a fundamental flaw in the process, and it is dangerous to our democracy, and we have to recognize that voter suppression, while it may target voters of color, it will affect us all. Ms. Escobar. Thank you, Ms. Abrams. Mr. Chairman, I yield back. Mr. Cohen. Thank you so much for your courtesy. Ms. Jackson Lee is recognized for 5 minutes. Ms. Jackson Lee. Let me thank the committee for holding this very important hearing, and for the record, I would like to put the following statement in. [The information follows:] [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT] Ms. Jackson Lee. Just after the purging of approximately 98,000 individuals in the State of Texas, Solicitor General Hawkins, Republican officials were quick to claim that the Secretary of State's actions were further evidence of growing threat of widespread voter fraud. On January 25, 2019, the Texas Attorney General sent a tweet proclaiming voter fraud alert. The Secretary of State discovered approximately 95,000 individuals--this is all a quote--identified by DPS as noncitizens having a matching voter registration record in Texas, approximately 58,000 of whom had voted in Texas elections. Any illegal vote deprives Americans of their voice. President Donald Trump tweeted 58,000 noncitizens voted in Texas, with 95,000 non-citizens registered to vote. These numbers are just the tip of the iceberg. All over the country, especially in California voter fraud is rampant. Must be stopped. Strong voter ID. Ms. Abrams, first of all, thank you for the work that you are doing in your new leadership, and certainly everyone watched the numbers of purging that occurred in Georgia. We are stuck on that, because I think you made a point is that purging suppresses and oppresses the vote, and it creates an aura of fear which happened in my Congressional district. So would you expand on that, with the aura of fear of purging, and also the exaggeration or the tilt when national leadership takes up the position that voter fraud is rampant across the country? Ms. Abrams. Certainly. Thank you for the question, Congresswoman. I would say, first, that there is a legitimate purpose to maintaining effective voter rolls. There is a legitimate purpose to laws that allow for the cleaning of rolls for people who have passed way, for people who are no longer eligible to vote, for people who moved from the State, and I do not believe there is any well-intentioned person who would say that cleaning and maintaining the rolls is improper. But what we argue is that the approach that has been taken has been so egregious and so flawed and sometimes so directly intended to harm voters of color, that we have undermined the intention of actually maintaining access to the rolls. In the State of Georgia, as I pointed out, 1.4 million people were purged between 2010 and 2018. Half a million were purged in a single day in the State of Georgia. That should raise alarms for anyone, because the reality is when you show up to vote, and you are told that you cannot cast a ballot because you have been removed from the rolls, even though you know that you should not have been, you are now called upon to become your own attorney, to argue with who is likely a volunteer that you have the right to vote. And if you happen to be in one of those hypersuppressive communities, that ability may be quashed. Georgia relied on an historic number of provisional ballots in the 2018 election. That meant that people cast their votes, believing they were allowed to actually make a choice only to have those votes later thrown out, and we have found a disturbing number of people who were given provisional ballots not because they were not effectively registered but because of the malfeasance and incompetence of the Secretary of State's office. Ms. Jackson Lee. Thank you. Solicitor General Hawkins, would you not argue, or could you not support the fact that minority voters are disproportionately affected by purging, and as I listen to your argument about having prevailed in the appellate court, you are right. As a lawyer, I understand the chances you take, but it is well known that the Fifth Circuit has never been supportive of civil rights legislation through the ages, so it is nothing unusual that you would have prevailed. My question, again, to you is, do you not see the purpose of looking to, or the purpose of purging outside of what gubernatorial candidate Abrams indicated of cleaning the rolls that you have seen being utilized to purge minority voters, particularly in Texas? Mr. Hawkins. Thank you for the question, Representative. First, I am not familiar with the lay of the landscape in Georgia, and I am not familiar with---- Ms. Jackson Lee. I am only asking you about Texas and the anecdote--not the anecdote but the statement that I read about the joy of purging 95,000 individuals through the Secretary of State's office in Texas. Mr. Hawkins. Representative, 95,000 individuals were not purged. Ms. Jackson Lee. Only after a lawsuit was filed. Mr. Hawkins. The Secretary of State does not have the power to remove anybody from the voter rolls. Ms. Jackson Lee. They sent the information to our local counties, and I can tell you, it created hysteria. Mr. Hawkins. And they may remove individuals from the voter rolls in counties only after a number of safeguards, including judicial review, have been surpassed. I think it is important to note that Texas---- Ms. Jackson Lee. The chilling effect was already there. Mr. Hawkins. I am sorry, Representative? Ms. Jackson Lee. The chilling effect was already present. Can you answer about Section 5? Is there any reason for Section 5 not to be reimplemented? Mr. Hawkins. Yes. The Supreme Court's decision in Shelby County, which held that preclearance under the current landscape is unconstitutional. Ms. Jackson Lee. If Congress is to reinstitute it, would there be any reason not to have it reinstituted? I understand Shelby. Mr. Hawkins. The Congress should pass legislation that is constitutional. In fact, Congresspersons have sworn an oath to the Constitution of the United States. Ms. Jackson Lee. We intend to do that. Mr. Cohen. Our time is up. Our time is up. Ms. Jackson Lee. Thank you. We intend to do that. Thank you. Mr. Cohen. Our time is up. Thank you. Mr. Collins wants to come. Is he here? He is. Mr. Gohmert. You would like to have questions? We want to get--they want to ask you questions. You know, it is up to you. He is from Texas, he is blah, blah, blah, and Ms. Abrams, you are free if you want to split. Mr. Nadler for a brief question, and then Mr. Gohmert. Chairman Nadler. Thank you. I was intrigued by something that Ms. Abrams said a few minutes ago when she said that, if I understood you correctly, that history of discrimination is not sufficient--I don't mean that--is not the only thing, is not the only thing that should justify preclearance. What else, in your opinion, should justify preclearance? Ms. Abrams. What we have found, not only through the work I have done in Georgia, but through conversations with colleagues in other States is that what is currently happening is that as demographic changes occur, and there are increasing numbers of people of color who have the right to vote, we are seeing a concomitant increase in the hurdles that are being placed in front of them to diminish their opportunity to vote. That has been seen in Wisconsin, in Ohio, in North Carolina. Across the country, we have seen increases in the chilling effect on the access to the right to vote. And therefore, any restoration of Section 5 should, I believe, set a universal standard that disallows any processes that would diminish the ability for people of color to access the right to vote, based not only on historical precedent, but based on current operations and current activities. Chairman Nadler. Thank you very much. Mr. Cohen. Thank you. And we have cabs for you all, and we will ask everybody to stay seated when we finish so they can get out and get to their cabs, and no pictures, no autographs. They have to make their cabs. Mr. Gohmert. Mr. Gohmert. Thank you. Mr. Hawkins, I know you are trying to catch a plane. Anything you need to respond to? I had some questions for you, and especially with regard to how Texas uses Section 2 of the Voting Rights Act. But anything based on what you have heard you want to add before you have to go? Mr. Hawkins. Thank you, Representative. I think it is important to underscore that Texas has a duty under State and Federal law to ensure that its voting rolls are accurate as does every other State. And, in fact, Texas has a compelling interest in ensuring that ineligible voters do not vote. Now, why is that so? It is because any time somebody votes unlawfully, that suppresses the vote of a lawful voter. And that is why we are seeing not just Texas, but many other the States, including just this week California, auditing voter rolls to ensure that only registered voters are--that only eligible voters are registered to vote. That is the purpose of auditing voter rolls, to ensure that the right to vote is protected because if somebody who is ineligible to vote votes, that suppresses the vote of a lawful citizen. Mr. Gohmert. I appreciate your efforts so much, and I would like to indicate for the record, and I won't have any further questions, Mr. Hawkins. I am told that you are trying to get away. But with regard to the need for this hearing and all, I think it is important to note the facts on the reauthorization of this. I was fairly new here in Congress, but it seemed very clear to me that since Section 4 had not been changed for about 40 years, it was still penalizing States for sins, wrongs, decades before by fathers and grandfathers, so to speak. And so, I know Chairman Sensenbrenner was pushing hard. He didn't want changes. He was not open to my suggestions. But we looked at a map of areas where there was a very definite problem, a disparity in the numbers based on racial voting, and there were some problems around the country that were not included in the States that had to get Section 5 clearance. And I had an amendment that would require any State that had a significant disparity in racial voting, they had to fall under Section 5. And let's update that, Section 4. Let's get a new standard in there. And Chairman Sensenbrenner said, Absolutely not. We are not changing it. And as I recall, there was a district in Wisconsin that had a significant disparity problem that might have fallen under Section 5. And Mr. Conyers was much more open to the idea of having an amendment that would require any district, any State in the country with a racial disparity problem would have brought them under Section 5. And I said most recently before the second time I talked to him, he was open to it. He said, you know, Louie, I have been talking to some of our experts, and they say Yeah, it is a risk. It might get struck down, so why don't we just go ahead and wait and see what happens? And I said I just talked to the previous dean of New York University Law School, and he said he sees a substantial chance that it will be struck down by the Supreme Court when it gets there. But the bill was done. They would not allow my amendment to be passed, and therefore, it would continue to punish only those who had engaged in wrongdoing decades before instead of bringing it current to make districts, States that were failing to have fairness racially have to answer under Section 5. And just as I predicted, just as others predicted, it got struck down, and we are still here without a modification that could have been done back in that reauthorization. So anyway, I am hoping that we will work things out. I am proud of the way Texas has been using Section 2 litigation to get this straight or get problems straightened out even without changes to Section 4, and I appreciate the chance to air these matters, and I yield back. Thank you very much. Mr. Cohen. Thank you, sir. We have got two more people that want to ask questions. If either one of you want to leave, you are free to leave. Mr. Hawkins. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I have to take off. Mr. Cohen. You agreed to 15 minutes. You did it. Thank you so much for your testimony. Ms. Abrams, we have got people willing to take you to the cab and get you out of here. Ms. Abrams. I can stay. Mr. Cohen. Great. Thank you, sir. First, Ms. Dean, you are recognized for 5 minutes. Ms. Dean. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and I thank all of the witnesses, those who had to leave and those for sharing your views and your expertise. As we know, this is an important subcommittee hearing. This is an important set of issues. Suffrage is as fundamental a right as any in our Constitution, and the right to vote lies at the very heart of our democracy, that delicate democracy. Benjamin Franklin famously noted that the Framers left us with a Republic, but only if we could keep it, and of course, central to keeping it is public participation in elections. A government of the people, by the people, for the people should mean all the people. And so I was interested--I apologize. I stepped out to go to another meeting, so if I am being redundant, I apologize. I hope I am not. I had terrific scouts here listening. One of the things I was interested in, under Section 5, jurisdictions were required to provide racial impact data to the Attorney General as part of the preclearance review process, including information on the anticipated effect on racial minority groups and also, where necessary, information on demographics, maps, annexations, election returns, language usage. Can you tell me, is that kind of data still being collected post Shelby? Ms. Abrams. I will defer to Ms. Aden. Ms. Dean. Ms. Aden. Ms. Aden. So you are absolutely correct that through the process, the burden was on jurisdictions to shine a light on what they were planning to change, and the burden was on them to show what was the impact. Was it going to lessen the ability of people of color, Native American, African American, Asian American, Latino to be able to participate? And as it stands, what H.R. 4 does and what we need is that notice again of the voting changes and the burden to show what the impact is to be placed on the jurisdictions seeking to implement that law. Ms. Dean. That is the other piece of it, and from anecdotal and your personal experience, the other piece is what you just said, shine a light on the proposed changes so the public was on notice. The public notice piece. And I assume that has now dropped away because we no longer have the Section 5 preclearance. So it is not only shine a light before any changes, the education of voters, but then also collect the data after to see what the impact. So now as a result of Shelby, we are not doing either. Is that right? Ms. Abrams. Correct. Under Fair Fight Action, we filed Federal litigation, and among our proofs, we were able to demonstrate that due to the purging of voters and the patterns of purging and the number of people who were forced to cast provisional ballots because of the ineffectiveness and the malfeasance of that process, there is essentially a racial map of African American communities that were subject to casting provisional ballots which have to be remedied. And if you are a working person, you might get Tuesday off. There is no allocation in State law to give you Wednesday and Thursday to go back and fix something that should never have been broken. Ms. Dean. Right. Ms. Abrams. We also know that Georgia had an extraordinary number of poll closures. We had 214 polls close out of roughly 3,000. Those are largely African American communities. And while those poll closures may have been permissible because of some nuance of law, what we found was that there was a disproportionate effect on communities of color, largely African American, particularly poor. If you do not own transportation, and there is no public transportation, the closure of a polling place that is 2 miles from your house now being moved to 10 miles from your house has not only a chilling effect on your right to vote, it absolutely negates your ability to cast that vote. Ms. Dean. I couldn't say it any more eloquently than that. I come from a previous experience in the Pennsylvania legislature, pre-Shelby. Before I had gotten there in 2011, I guess, or early 2012, Pennsylvania passed a voter ID law which was ultimately struck down as unconstitutional, but I was a brand new State representative trying to help people navigate the world of what am I going to do if I need some sort of specified identification. We know exactly what that was intended to do. And I will close with this notion because I wasn't here. Sometimes I think witnesses have something they wish they could have been asked, and they didn't get the chance to say it, so may I ask you, Ms. Abrams, is there something more that you wanted to say, and the same to you, Ms. Aden. Ms. Abrams. I do think, and I want to reiterate this false connection that is being drawn between voter turnout rates among communities of color, and voter suppression. These are not correlated. One can have intentional laws and practices to discriminate against voters and have a concomitant effort by communities that care about these issues to push back and to provide access. I am a part of a long legacy of people who have responded to oppression by making certain that we overreact, and that we overperform, but we cannot ignore the fact that that discrimination still exists. Discrimination doesn't cease to exist simply because there are those who are willing to fight back. That fighting back should demonstrate how important it is to eliminate the discrimination on its face. Ms. Dean. Thank you, Ms. Aden. Ms. Aden. And I just want to correct that. The reason why we focus on Texas is because we love Texas. In fact, we love the voters of Texas. We want people to participate. So I don't want today to be a show just about Texas or just about Georgia. As Ms. Abrams said, Congress can and must hold hearings and look at the landscape of voter suppression across the country. Look at what is happening to Native American voters in North Dakota, where they are required to have an address on their photo ID, even though many live on reservations and do not have that. Look at Kansas where one polling place was left open, and it was out of town, and there is no public transportation. Look at Wisconsin, which has been invoked. Look across the country. And it cannot be the case that we are happy with the way that elections are taking place in our country. It is unacceptable. And it is because we love the people who want to participate that is incumbent upon us to work to fix the problem. Mr. Cohen. Thank you very much. Thank you, Ms. Dean. Now we recognize Mr. Collins. Mr. Collins. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Ms. Abrams, and one of the things that is good about this, and I am glad you are here. In 2011, back in a different time in a different world for both of us, you voted in favor of a bill to reduce early voting period to 3 weeks and add a Saturday, correct? Ms. Abrams. Correct. Mr. Collins. House Bill 92. I will enter that into the record. It has been stated earlier by the chairman of this committee---- Mr. Cohen. Without objection. [The information follows:] ======================================================================= _______________________________________________________________________ MR. COLLINS FOR THE OFFICIAL RECORD ======================================================================= [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT] Mr. Collins. Thank you [continuing]. By the chairman of this committee that restricting early voting has actually had a disproportionate impact on minority voters. I know that was very much a concern for you at the time, and you and Representative Mark Hamilton had those conversations, and it was showed that there was either no difference in participation, or actually, there was at least a benefit to minority voters at that time. Would you agree with that statement? Ms. Abrams. I would agree, but I believe it is important to clarify. Georgia at the time had an outsized number of early voting days, 45 early voting days. The national standard, the gold standard was 21 days. Therefore, what Georgia did by reducing from 45 to 21 days was to come into conformity with the most appreciated and the most accepted role for early voting. Mr. Collins. Exactly. Ms. Abrams. However, since that time, there were multiple opportunities, multiple attempts made in the Georgia general assembly to actually restrict from 21 to 7 days, and I vigorously opposed every one of those bills and fought them back. Mr. Collins. Reclaiming my time. I was not there. We were there on this one, and I think the interesting issue was is the point that I am making is that when you do carefully calculate, it was to the norm. There was not a discriminal threat, and the statements of broad impact can't be used all the time because it leads to bad decisions when you blanketly say something affects in a disproportionate way. You just admitted, I just saw, and we had the bill pass. But in that 3-week period which was part of what was actually said by our chairman, it did not do that. A 7-day, we could probably agree on, but in that part, it did not. So you can't blanketly say bringing back early voting does that. Another issue that has that has come to mind, and I have a question. I am glad you said it and a previous witness. You said there are reasons to keep a voter roll accurate. The question, though, as you come into this process, you stated something earlier about exact match that I am not sure we actually--I want to make sure that we are clear on. And this is a couple yes-nos. 1.4 million were purged. You say that. It is in your written testimony. Do you believe all of those were purged for wrong reasons? Yes or no? Ms. Abrams. Of course not. Mr. Collins. Okay. Let's look at that. The question you also said among the exact match and the 53,000 voter registrations we will use as you put in your thing was held hostage. The question has--and you said it is because of government bureaucrats or government workers who mistakenly put information in, and that is the only reason you have given that these exact match doesn't work. Is it not true that, however, the person who is actually inputting information has to have accurate information to put in so that it is accurate? Would that be a fair statement? Ms. Abrams. I do not believe that fairly characterizes the---- Mr. Collins. So you do not believe that a statement, something that is given--if I put a--filled out a form and it was half filled out, or I did not put my last name, or I did not put my date of birth, or I did not put an exact--I did not put an address, is that a form that can be actually used by a local voter registrar to actually fill out a form that would do an exact match? Yes or no? Ms. Abrams. Sir, it is impossible to provide a yes-or-no answer to that question, because the exact match is not simply the question of what was put on the form. The challenge with exact match is not the entry on the form. It is the database that is then used to verify the access to this information. And so absent the second part of the process, it is an impossibility to give a truthful answer to the question presented. Mr. Collins. But the truth--and you are still as good as I remember you. The issue is here, though, is not this. If it is not right for the exact match, to match what they need to match for verification process, if I turned it in, still did not match it up, it was my input on the form or the person collecting or the group collecting this that did not turn in a form that a person in the voter registration office could actually use to do exact match, not what they were matching to. But if I did not give them proper match, then that is the problem. There has at least got to be the understanding it is not just a government data input problem, and we are not throwing all voter registration people under the bus with this. I think that is the problem that I have in your answer, because it implies a governmental problem, which also goes back to a bigger issue that I have here, and that is the implication that Brian Kemp, the Governor of the State of Georgia, is the person behind all of the problems here. And this has become a bigger question for the State that you and I love. When you had a former presidential or a presidential--a current presidential candidate come to Georgia and make a statement in your defense and basically said that Stacey Abrams will be Governor of Georgia if Georgia wasn't racist. I don't think that is what you want Georgia to be looked at, and I don't think that is what I wanted, and I have actually talked to this individual. The question is making sure we have accurate voter rolls, even by your group's administration, making sure that our accurate voter rolls are there, and that people have a possibility of doing that. The question, though--one last question that I have in here, and we could go on, but I know you have got a flight, and I will see you again, hopefully under different circumstances, but one question bugged me from the whole time I watched it. There was a clip, and you said it even afterwards. When we are talking about our voter rolls being there for every person, every citizen, do you believe that non-citizens should vote in the State of Georgia? Ms. Abrams. No, and I have never said that non-citizens should be allowed to vote. Mr. Collins. What did you say, by the way? Ms. Abrams. What I said was that the blue wave which was not a reference to the right to vote, but a reference to the resistance of this administration's policies that have disenfranchised, dehumanized, and harmed the ability for people of the United States of America to fully exercise their rights and freedoms, that the change that would come, which is euphemistically referred to as the blue wave would be achieved by people who are both documented and undocumented. That did not refer to, and in fact, it has been proven through Politifact analysis I never once called for anyone who is not legally eligible to vote to be able to do so. And I would refer you to our long tenure together, where I worked with Democrats and Republicans to always ensure the integrity of the right to vote. It has been my practice as an adult since my time in college. And with due respect, the reality is that we as a Nation stand as an emblem of what democracy can mean, and that is diminished when there are irregularities, when there are malfeasance and misfeasance activities that undermine the right to vote. And that is what I have called attention to, and that is the work that I am doing. Mr. Collins. And that is exactly what the problem is, is when we have the far--even from groups taping---- Mr. Cohen. Our time is up. Thank you, Mr. Collins. I appreciate the panelists coming and your testimony. We will have 5 days for members to come up with questions, and they can submit them in writing, and we would ask you to answer them. And with that, the hearing is adjourned. [Whereupon, at 4:53 p.m., the subcommittee was adjourned.] ======================================================================= _______________________________________________________________________ APPENDIX ======================================================================= [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]