[House Hearing, 118 Congress]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]



 

                                 


 
                  UNDER THE MICROSCOPE: EXAMINING THE 
                 CENSORSHIP-INDUSTRIAL COMPLEX AND ITS 
                  IMPACT ON AMERICAN SMALL BUSINESSES

=======================================================================

                                HEARING

                               before the

                      COMMITTEE ON SMALL BUSINESS
                             UNITED STATES
                        HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

                    ONE HUNDRED EIGHTEENTH CONGRESS

                             SECOND SESSION

                               __________

                              HEARING HELD
                             JUNE 26, 2024

                               __________

   [GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]                      
                               

            Small Business Committee Document Number 118-054
             Available via the GPO Website: www.govinfo.gov
             
             
                          ______

             U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE 
 55-971             WASHINGTON : 2024
 
 
             
             
                   HOUSE COMMITTEE ON SMALL BUSINESS

                    ROGER WILLIAMS, Texas, Chairman
                      BLAINE LUETKEMEYER, Missouri
                        PETE STAUBER, Minnesota
                        DAN MEUSER, Pennsylvania
                         BETH VAN DUYNE, Texas
                         MARIA SALAZAR, Florida
                          TRACEY MANN, Kansas
                           JAKE ELLZEY, Texas
                        MARC MOLINARO, New York
                         MARK ALFORD, Missouri
                           ELI CRANE, Arizona
                          AARON BEAN, Florida
                           WESLEY HUNT, Texas
                         NICK LALOTA, New York
                          CELESTE MALOY, Utah
               NYDIA VELAZQUEZ, New York, Ranking Member
                          JARED GOLDEN, Maine
                        DEAN PHILLIPS, Minnesota
                          GREG LANDSMAN, Ohio
                  MARIE GLUESENKAMP PEREZ, Washington
                        SHRI THANEDAR, Michigan
                       MORGAN MCGARVEY, Kentucky
                       HILLARY SCHOLTEN, Michigan
                          JUDY CHU, California
                         SHARICE DAVIDS, Kansas
                      CHRIS PAPPAS, New Hampshire

                  Ben Johnson, Majority Staff Director
                 Melissa Jung, Minority Staff Director
                            C O N T E N T S

                           OPENING STATEMENTS

                                                                   Page
Hon. Roger Williams..............................................     1
Hon. Nydia Velazquez.............................................     3

                               WITNESSES

Ms. Jenin Younes, Litigation Counsel, New Civil Liberties 
  Alliance, Washington, DC.......................................     5
Mr. Benjamin Weingarten, Investigative Journalist & Columnist, 
  RealClearInvestigations & RealClearPolitics, Washington, DC....     7
Ms. Carrie Sheffield, Senior Policy Analyst, Independent Women's 
  Forum, Winchester, VA..........................................     9
Dr. Mary Anne Franks, Eugene L. and Barbara A. Bernard Professor 
  in Intellectual Property, Technology, and Civil Rights Law, 
  George Washington Law School, Washington, DC...................    11

                                APPENDIX

Prepared Statements:
    Ms. Jenin Younes, Litigation Counsel, New Civil Liberties 
      Alliance, Washington, DC...................................    30
    Mr. Benjamin Weingarten, Investigative Journalist & 
      Columnist, RealClearInvestigations & RealClearPolitics, 
      Washington, DC.............................................    34
    Ms. Carrie Sheffield, Senior Policy Analyst, Independent 
      Women's Forum, Winchester, VA..............................    45
    Dr. Mary Anne Franks, Eugene L. and Barbara A. Bernard 
      Professor in Intellectual Property, Technology, and Civil 
      Rights Law, George Washington Law School, Washington, DC...    50
Questions and Answers for the Record:
    Questions from Hon. Nydia Velazquez to Dr. Mary Anne Franks 
      and Answers from Dr. Mary Anne Franks......................    54
Additional Material for the Record:
    American Sunlight Project....................................    57
    Rumble, CEO, Chris Pavlovski.................................    63
    The Free Press...............................................    65


 UNDER THE MICROSCOPE: EXAMINING THE CENSORSHIP-INDUSTRIAL COMPLEX AND 
                ITS IMPACT ON AMERICAN SMALL BUSINESSES

                              ----------                              


                        WEDNESDAY, JUNE 26, 2024

                  House of Representatives,
               Committee on Small Business,
                                                    Washington, DC.
    The Committee met, pursuant to call, at 10:02 a.m., in Room 
2360, Rayburn House Office Building, Hon. Roger Williams 
[chairman of the Committee] presiding.
    Present: Representatives Williams, Luetkemeyer, Meuser, Van 
Duyne, Alford, Crane, Bean, Maloy, Velazquez, Landsman, 
Scholten, Thanedar, and Davids.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. I want Mr. Crane from the great State of 
Arizona to lead us in the pledge and the prayer. Would you 
please stand.
    Mr. CRANE. All right. We will pray first. Lord, thank you 
for opportunity to be here this morning. We ask that You 
continue to bless this nation. We ask that you would continue 
to bless small businesses in our economy. We ask that you will 
bless this committee hearing today in Your name. Amen.
    All. Amen.
    I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of 
America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation, 
under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. So good morning, everyone. I now call 
the Committee on Small Business to order. Without objection, 
the Chair is authorized to declare a recess of the committee at 
any time.
    We are going to do things a little differently today 
because we are expecting votes to be called around 10:30. So we 
will do our best to get through opening statements 
introductions, or witness testimony before we recess to go 
vote. We will then reconvene when votes are complete and begin 
Member questions at that time. So I now recognize myself for my 
opening statement.
    Welcome to today's hearing, which will examine how the 
federal government is tipping the scales against certain 
business online. I would like to start off by thanking our 
witnesses for being with us today. Your attendance and input on 
these important issues is greatly appreciated.
    The online marketplace is essential for small businesses 
and generate revenue in the modern economy. Business owners use 
social media and online platforms to reach their customers' 
earned revenue from advertising and promote products. Over a 
year ago it was brought to this committee's attention that the 
government has funded certain third-party organizations, which 
are making it harder for conservative businesses to succeed 
online.
    Now when I first heard about this, it seemed simply un-
American and against what we should stand for as a country. Our 
economy is based on competition, where anyone that has a 
superior product, price, or customer service is able to build a 
successful business.
    However, during this committee's investigation, we found 
out that this is simply no longer the case. The committee 
uncovered a vast networks of non-profits, research groups, and 
other entities that receive government funding with the goal of 
stopping misinformation. As these groups attempt to define what 
is true, there are many voices and businesses whose reach is 
being reduced simply because they believe something that is 
against the mainstream narrative.
    An example of a viewpoint that would prevent the reach of a 
business or publisher online would be that the COVID-19 virus 
is man-made, and came from a lab. Even though this is now a 
widely not--this is now a wildly accepted theory, about how 
global pandemic began, this view expressed just 2 years ago 
would have been censored online and limited the reach of your 
business.
    The issue has extremely consequential First Amendment 
implications which are working their way through the judicial 
system, and this hearing will examine how the efforts had been 
trickling down to affect small businesses.
    The committee uncovered three main ways in which the small 
business ultimately could get affected by these censorship 
efforts: First these misinformation organizations flagged with 
content and acceptable posts on social media websites, thereby 
eliminating the reach to customers if they get in the cross 
hairs of these third parties; now secondly, there are 
government-led pressure campaigns to remove certain businesses 
from online marketplaces, preventing them from selling their 
products over the internet; and, finally, these organizations 
hinder businesses from earning an advertising revenue and other 
income streams by diminishing a business' reputation in the 
case of media outlets, their circulation.
    To put this plain and simple, the government has been 
caught collaborating with private entities to censor narratives 
that they don't like. And yes, your taxpayer dollars are being 
used to do this.
    Main street is constantly working as hard as possible to 
compete and thrive. The emergence of online marketplaces has 
provided millions of small businesses with new ways to make 
money and reach customers. However, we have found out that all 
businesses online are not given a fair chance to succeed in 
this new battleground.
    So if you do not agree with a company, the customer can 
choose not to do business with them. But when the government 
inserts itself in the process to tip the scales against certain 
businesses, it simply is unacceptable.
    So finally, I ask unanimous consent to enter into the 
record a statement from Rumble CEO, Chris Pavlovski, 
emphasizing the importance of free speech to not only this 
country, but to small business upon which our economy depends. 
So without objection, it is so ordered.
    I want to thank you all again for being here with us today, 
and I am looking forward to today's important conversation. And 
with that I yield to our distinguished Ranking Member from New 
York, Ms. Velazquez.
    Ms. VELAZQUEZ. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Good morning, 
everyone, and thank you for being here.
    I must admit, when I heard the title of this hearing, I was 
terrified. The Censorship Industrial Complex--that sounds 
frightening. The thought that thousands of universities, NGOs, 
and government agencies are pondering to silence any dissenting 
views is a horrifying proposition. Are they really trying to 
silence our cherished small businesses? Thankfully, the idea 
itself is fiction, cynically created by the right-wing outrage 
machine to drum up fear during election season.
    There is simply no evidence that anyone in the small 
business community is being censored by the government for 
legitimate political speech. Nor is there evidence that the 
accused universities and NGOs that make up the so-called 
Censorship Industrial Complex have actually censored anyone.
    A quick look into the facts of my colleagues' investigation 
reveals a baseless effort to stir up anger and fear as we 
approach election season. It is the oldest trick in the book, 
and a cynical misuse of committee resources.
    Let's take a look at the basic claims of their 
investigation. First, the major claim is that the U.S. 
Government funded the development of software that censors 
conservative media. However, the fact is that a nonprofit 
organization had already developed proprietary software that 
can detect patterns of misinformation online.
    The Global Engagement Center of the State Department gave 
an award of $100,000 for 3 months of work to expand that 
software to six more languages: Chinese, Japanese, Korean, 
Vietnamese, Russian, and Ukrainian, to be used in Asia and 
Eastern Europe. I suspect few of my colleagues will be against 
the State Department using its resources to detect Chinese or 
Russian propaganda overseas. However, that is exactly what they 
are attacking at a crucial moment in history for our national 
security.
    The second major claim is that this software has been used 
primarily to censor conservatives here in the U.S. Again, this 
is baseless. The software assembles a list of thousands of 
websites around the world, a small fraction of which are 
American, which have a tendency to publish what they call 
adversarial content. Basically, content created to drive 
engagement by creating outrage.
    Advertisers realized a long time ago that social media 
algorithms boost this type of content because it helps keep 
users online, but they do not want to sponsor it. This software 
fills a niche that advertising agencies were asking for. It is 
not censorship. It is capitalism, something my colleagues 
usually, without a doubt, support.
    After all, if companies were forced to sponsor content they 
disagree with, that would be an egregious violation of the 
freedom of speech.
    Let's acknowledge what this investigation truly is an 
attempt by the majority to weaponize the federal government 
against universities and nonprofit organizations they disagree 
with. They want you to believe conservatives across the country 
are being silenced by some Orwellian censorship regime. That is 
pure fiction.
    In reality, it is they who seek to silence this 
organization through threat of lawfare, investigation, and by 
encouraging harassment. It is censorship by proxy.
    Mr. Chairman, when it comes to the intersection of social 
media, free speech, and small businesses, they are plenty of 
legitimate points of debate.
    We could talk about Section 230, or the concentrated 
private power of just a few tech companies to dictate who seeks 
what, or whose voice gets heard. We could talk about the 
reliance of small businesses on these platforms, and the power 
platforms have to charge high fees. We could even talk about 
how small firms are innovators, influencers, creators, and 
engineers of these platforms.
    Mr. Chairman, the Censorship Industrial Complex is simply a 
distraction. My hope will be that you will use the gavel to 
bring attention to real issues facing small businesses. While 
we may disagree on tax or regulatory policy or the best way to 
help small firms access capital, we can actually agree that 
those are real issues. I yield back. Thank you.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back. And I will 
now introduce our witnesses.
    Now our first witness here with us today is Jenin Younes. 
Ms. Younes is litigation counsel for the New Civil Liberties 
Alliance located here in Washington, D.C. At the New Civil 
Liberties Alliance, Ms. Younes has played a significant role in 
First Amendment challenges to the government's involvement in 
censorship and social media. Ms. Younes graduated from the New 
York University School of Law where she earned her doctorate of 
law degree, and from Cornell, which I think we have a colleague 
that also went to Cornell up here.
    Ms. VAN DUYNE. [Inaudible.]
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Well, there is two of you. That is 
scarier--earned her degree of law from Cornell University where 
she earned her bachelor of art's degree. So thank you for 
joining us today. And I am looking forward to today's important 
conversation.
    Our next witness here with us today is Mr. Benjamin 
Weingarten. Mr. Weingarten is investigative journalist and 
columnist for the RealClearInvestigations and 
RealClearPolitics. In addition to his role as RealClear, Mr. 
Weingarten is a columnist and contributor to several print and 
media outlets, including the Federalist and Newsweek. Mr. 
Weingarten is also the founder and CEO of Changeup Media, a 
media consulting production firm helping individuals and 
institutions create compelling content.
    Mr. Weingarten graduated from Columbia University where he 
earned his bachelor of arts degree in economics and political 
science. I want to thank you, sir, for being here with us today 
and look forward to our conversation.
    Our next witness here with us today is Ms. Carrie 
Sheffield. Ms. Sheffield is the senior policy analyst at the 
Independent Women's Forum located here in Washington, D.C. As a 
former small business owner in the digital media industry, Ms. 
Sheffield knows the importance of advertising to reach new 
customers and grow your audience. Ms. Sheffield is familiar 
with the inequities considered conservatives face in this 
space. Ms. Sheffield is the author of the best-selling book, 
``Motorhome Prophecies: A Journey of Healing and Forgiveness.'' 
And like many authors, Ms. Sheffield knows the importance of 
using platforms like Amazon to sell books and products. Ms. 
Sheffield earned her bachelor of arts in communication from 
Brigham Young University, then went on to earn her master of 
policy from Harvard University.
    I want to thank you each for joining us today. I am also 
looking forward to our conversation. And with that I now 
recognize the Ranking Member from New York, Ms. Velazquez, to 
briefly introduce our last witness appearing before us today.
    Ms. VELAZQUEZ. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Our final witness 
today is Dr. Mary Anne Franks. Dr. Franks is the Eugene L. and 
Barbara A. Bernard Professor in Intellectual Property, 
Technology, and Civil Rights Law at the George Washington 
University Law School. She is an internationally recognized 
expert on the intersection of civil rights, free speech, and 
technology. Dr. Franks is also the president and latest leader 
and tech policy director of the Cyber Civil Rights Initiative. 
A nonprofit dedicated to combating online abuse and 
discrimination. She holds a juris doctorate from Harvard Law 
School, and a doctorate and master's degree from Oxford 
University where she studied as a Rhodes scholar. Thank you, 
Dr. Franks, for providing your testimony today.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Thank you, and we appreciate, again, all 
of you being here today. So before recognizing witnesses, I 
would like to remind them that their oral testimony is 
restricted to 5 minutes in length. That is important. And if 
you see the light turn red in front of you, it means your 5 
minutes have concluded, and you should wrap up your testimony. 
If you keep going, you are going to hear this. That means stop, 
okay?
    So I now recognize Ms. Younes for her 5-minute opening 
remarks.

   STATEMENTS OF JENIN YOUNES, LITIGATION COUNSEL, NEW CIVIL 
LIBERTIES ALLIANCE, ON BEHALF OF NEW CIVIL LIBERTIES ALLIANCE; 
 BENJAMIN WEINGARTEN, INVESTIGATIVE JOURNALIST AND COLUMNIST, 
   REALCLEARINVESTIGATIONS & REALCLEARPOLITICS, ON BEHALF OF 
REALCLEARINVESTIGATIONS & REALCLEARPOLITICS; CARRIE SHEFFIELD, 
SENIOR POLICY ANALYST, INDEPENDENT WOMEN'S FORUM, ON BEHALF OF 
INDEPENDENT WOMEN'S FORUM; AND DR. MARY ANNE FRANKS, EUGENE L. 
  AND BARBARA A. BERNARD PROFESSOR IN INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY, 
 TECHNOLOGY, AND CIVIL RIGHTS LAW, GEORGE WASHINGTON LAW SCHOOL

                   STATEMENT OF JENIN YOUNES

    Ms. YOUNES. Chairman Williams, Ranking Member Velazquez, 
and Members of the committee, thank you for having me here 
today. Over the past several years, investigative journalists, 
lawyers, and individual Americans have uncovered a vast federal 
censorship enterprise that targets American speech on social 
media.
    In the words of a White House staffer named Rob Flaherty, 
this enterprise stems from the highest levels of the White 
House and involves the efforts of at least a dozen federal 
agencies, if not more. Politicians and media have attempted to 
portray these efforts as laudable attempts to fight 
misinformation, disinformation, and malinformation on social 
media. Of course what constitutes misinformation, 
disinformation, and malinformation are determines made by the 
censors.
    Government actors have used threats, coercion, pressure, 
and influence on private social media companies to effectuate 
censorship of disfavored views, including scientists such as 
Jayanta Bhattacharya and Martin Kulldorff, and journalists like 
Alex Berenson. That conduct is the subject of a case that was 
just decided in the Supreme Court about 10 minutes ago, and I 
still haven't had a chance to read the decision, Murthy v. 
Missouri.
    In the other cases, the government has outsourced private 
censorship programs--sorry, censorship programs to private 
industry in attempts to circumvent First Amendment strictures.
    The State Department, through its Global Engagement Center, 
has funded the development, marketing, and promotion of 
hundreds of tools and technologies designed to combat 
misinformation and disinformation online. They act with the 
purpose of depriving our clients, Daily Wire and Federalist, 
and other disfavored media outlets of revenue and visibility, 
thereby diminishing their reach on social media and elsewhere. 
Our clients were severely impacted, along with hundreds of 
other small independent and conservative-leaning news outlets 
and journalists.
    Why is this a problem? First, Congress created GEC within 
the State Department to counter foreign propaganda and 
disinformation efforts. Congress also included a funding 
limitation. None of the funds authorized to be appropriated or 
otherwise made available to carry out this section shall be 
used for purposes other than counting foreign propaganda and 
misinformation that threatened United States national security. 
Yet GEC is intricately involved in the development of 
technologies that are intended to and do result in the 
suppression of American speech. This use of funds to stifle 
domestic speech constitutes an unlawful misappropriation of 
funds. It is also an alter virus action because GEC's mandate 
is to counter foreign propaganda.
    Second, even if Congress wanted to, it could not 
constitutionally give GEC the authority to fund market and 
promote companies like NewsGuard and GDI because this activity 
violates the First Amendment.
    Supreme Court jurisprudence has made clear the government 
cannot use private industry to accomplish what the Constitution 
prohibits from doing directly.
    In a case called Norwood v. Harrison, for example, the 
court said it is axiomatic that the government may not induce, 
encourage, or promote private persons to accomplish what it is 
constitutionally forbidden to accomplish.
    Another indication that this program is not and never was 
about protecting Americans' national security interest is that 
companies such as NewsGuard and GDI targeted primarily if not 
exclusively conservative speech, which should strike any fair-
minded person as suspect. Its viewpoint discrimination and its 
anathema to the First Amendment, which doesn't tolerate 
government silencing views of political adversaries.
    By the way, I am not a political conservative or 
Republican. I am left-leaning. To say the least, I don't agree 
with much of the speech that has been the subject of this 
censorship program. But I recognize that it is extremely 
dangerous to put government in deciding--in charge of deciding 
who and what should be heard and who and what should be 
silenced. That is precisely what the Framers of the 
Constitution issued when they included the First Amendment in 
the Bill of Rights. They understood the government actors are 
just people, and in no better position than I or any American 
to decide what is true and false.
    The First Amendment implicitly recognizes our dignity as 
individuals. We are not inferior beings who need to be told who 
or what to believe by a monarch. We are capable of evaluating 
competing claims in light of our individual experiences and 
perspectives.
    Some say the plethora of information that social media 
allows to be put forth at a rapid pace requires governmental 
interference, once again, protect people from bad or false 
ideas. But social media doesn't change the fundamental premise 
underpinning the First Amendment. The best way to address 
problematic or false ideas is through counter speech, not 
censorship.
    Censorship does not make bad ideas or lies go away. It 
drives them underground where they fester. As the saying goes, 
sunlight is the best disinfectant. And rapidity with which 
information may be posted on social media also means that lies 
and other problematic speech can be combated that much more 
quickly.
    Those who think there is nothing wrong with the government 
censorship regime exposed through this case as well as Murthy 
v. Missouri should think long and hard about what this means 
when power changes hands. Do you want President Trump's 
administration funding tools and technologies designed to 
censor speech he disfavors? It is time Americans recognize the 
danger we face, not from misinformation, disinformation, or 
malinformation, but from our government deeming itself arbiter 
of the truth and inserting itself into the marketplace of ideas 
so as to silence those that it disfavors. Thank you.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The time is up. I now recognize Mr. 
Weingarten for his 5-minute opening remarks.

                STATEMENT OF BENJAMIN WEINGARTEN

    Mr. WEINGARTEN. Chairman Williams, Ranking Member 
Velazquez, and Members of the committee, thank you for the 
opportunity to testify.
    Free speech and a free press are bedrock features of our 
republic. The Censorship-Industrial Complex therefore imperils 
our republic.
    Disturbingly, the U.S. Government has played an indelible 
role in fostering this censorship regime--one that has purged 
unauthorized opinions and inconvenient facts en masse.
    Today's hearing highlights one insidious instance of it: 
federal funding, direct and indirect, via the State 
Department's Global Engagement Center, of entities in NewsGuard 
and GDI that threaten the viability of media companies that 
dare to dissent from establishment orthodoxy.
    The relationships this committee is probing and the 
stonewalling it has faced should concern all Americans. GEC's 
stated mission is to counter ``foreign...propaganda and 
disinformation efforts.'' NewsGuard says it aims to 
``systematically defund sources of harmful misinformation''--
foreign and domestic. It does so by rating and reviewing 
thousands of outlets for ``reliability'' and creating what it 
calls ``exclusion lists''--blacklists for brands to provide ad 
agencies and ad tech partners for use in determining where not 
to place ads.
    GDI, likewise, says it seeks to ``reduce'' disinformation 
by ``remov[ing] the financial incentive'' it says works behind 
it, ad revenue. It took arms ad-tech companies with a ``dynamic 
exclusion list''--reportedly containing 2,000 ``risky'' 
publications, including American ones. Perversely then, a 
foreign-facing agency has supported entities that exist to put 
disfavored domestic outlets out of business. Those NewsGuard 
and GDI have targeted suggest they have been smeared and 
stigmatized for taking positions on matters from COVID-19 to 
the war in Ukraine, contrary to those of the political 
establishment, consequently incurring financial and 
reputational damage.
    NewsGuard's alleged viewpoint discrimination can be seen in 
the significantly higher scores on average that it has lavished 
on left-learning sources over right-leaning ones--and in the 
Kafkaesque correspondences dissident sources left and right 
have had with its readers when challenging seemingly unmerited 
scores.
    GDI's blacklist isn't public, but its 2022 report on 
``disinformation risk'' among U.S. sources betrays a similar 
bias. There, it lists among its 10 least risky publications 
nine liberal--too progressive corporate media outlets--and The 
Wall Street Journal. Its 10 riskiest publications include nine 
conservative or libertarian outlets and RealClearPolitics. Many 
maligned by NewsGuard and GDI report plummeting ad revenues--
which GDI's executives have gloated about. Some say they have 
lost traffic.
    Our experience at RealClearPolitics and 
RealClearInvestigations may be more troubling. RCP's bread and 
butter is curating compelling analysis--from sources left and 
right, corporate and independent--on key issues of the day, so 
readers can weigh both sides. We score a 62 on NewsGuard's 100-
point scale based on the subjective assessments of NewsGuard's 
journalists, who analyze a sample of other journalists' work to 
render judgment on whole outlet.
    Amazingly, NewsGuard dings us in part for our quote, 
unquote, ``undisclosed'' conservative bent. The implication is 
that it either dismisses the feature of viewpoint diversity 
that we promote, or worse, sees viewpoint diversity as a bug.
    RCP, mind you, ranks below NPR, The Washington Post, and 
Politico, all of which garner perfect NewsGuard scores despite 
their biases and bungles. These scores influence not only 
advertisers but up to half a billion readers through 
NewsGuard's partnerships. They appear next to sites in search 
results on browsers equipped with NewsGuard's extension. A low 
rating is a digital Scarlet letter.
    RealClear investigations curates deep dives from sundry 
sources and publishes our own from journalists with diverse 
perspectives--some antithetical to my own. NewsGuard has 
branded us biased as well, albeit while giving us an 80. The 
rater would seem to see bias in our pursuit of stories and 
angles competitors miss or ignore. It took RCI to task for 
unmasking the whistleblower behind the first impeachment of 
President Trump--in the face of political pressure, our silent 
peers folded under.
    As for GDI, beyond landing on its risky list, RCP may be on 
its secret blacklist, too.
    Now RealClear has thrived despite these entities, but the 
Censorship-Industrial Complex has made a highly competitive 
business harder, and placed us at a competitive disadvantage. 
Our ad revenue has declined materially, forcing us to devote 
substantially more time and resources to fundraising. We have 
seen a meaningful drop in certain search rankings. And we've 
taken a reputational hit.
    Even if the risk raters were unobjectionable, the 
fundamental issue would remain. Through funding and supporting 
such entities, government has abridged our freedom of speech 
and of the press by proxy. Taxpayer dollars should not back 
those who would silence Americans by destroying our media 
businesses. Thank you.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back. I now 
recognize Ms. Sheffield for her 5-minute opening remarks.

                 STATEMENT OF CARRIE SHEFFIELD

    Ms. SHEFFIELD. Mr. Chairman, Ms. Ranking Member, thank you 
for inviting me today. My name is Carrie Sheffield, and I am a 
senior policy analyst at the Center for Economic Opportunity at 
Independent Women's Forum. We are a nonprofit organization 
committed to increasing the number of women who value free 
markets and personally liberty.
    Prior to my current role, I founded Bold TV, a small 
business which I ran from 2015 until selling its assets in 2019 
to an educational nonprofit. Bold TV is a digital media news 
network featuring newsmakers across politics, business, and 
lifestyle.
    At Bold TV, we utilize tools from Facebook Live, Instagram, 
Twitter, Amazon Fire, Apple News, YouTube, and other tech and 
content distribution partners to grow our audience.
    Just prior to my departure, our viewership was 
approximately 30 to 70,000 views on each Bold TV program which 
approximately 10.16 million organic impressions for the first 6 
months of 2019.
    In addition to social media monetization tools, Bold TV 
also maintained a website using a private marketplace ad 
exchange network for revenue.
    I am also an author with my first book, Motorhomes 
Prophecies, published in March by Hachette Book Group. My 
publisher uses ad exchanges to sell books. Ad exchanges are the 
lifeblood of small businesses, both for selling and promoting 
their content to external audiences. A recent survey from the 
Connected Commerce Council of more than 2,400 businesses found 
that among small and mid-size businesses, SMBs, 40 percent of 
SMB publishers say that digital ads drive over half of their 
overall revenue.
    The survey also found 71 percent of SMB publishers, 
including 72 percent of Black and 65 percent of Hispanic-led 
SMB publishers say they could not have launched and sustained 
their business without digital advertising revenue. Seventy-
nine percent of SMB publishers say digital ads helped them 
compete with much larger competitors.
    My media experience leads me to believe government censors 
and interferes with small businesses. This impacts businesses' 
abilities to use digital ads and sell products in the online 
marketplaces such as Amazon, Etsy, or eBay.
    For example, under the leadership of Chairwoman Lina Khan, 
President Biden's Federal Trade Commission seeks to punish 
authors by like myself by harming our ability to sell books on 
Amazon at lower prices to customers.
    The government can also interfere with advertising revenue 
by supporting companies that attack the credibility of 
businesses. This can occur through government reliance on 
organizations, such as the Global Disinformation Index, GDI, a 
media-rating website.
    GDI appears to be a tool for the U.S. Government to 
circumvent our First Amendment rights and censor American small 
businesses. Evidence suggests the U.S. State Department gave 
taxpayer funds to GDI, which then downrated conservative media 
organizations, including the Daily Wire and the Federalist.
    In response, the Federalist and the Daily Wire jointly 
fired a lawsuit in December. The complaint alleges the Biden 
administration used U.S. funds to tap GDI which has 
relationships with social media giants and deep-pocketed 
advertisers.
    Federal election data shows State Department employees for 
many years have favored Democrats over Republicans with their 
political contributions. For example, during the 2016 cycle, 
State Department employees gave Democrats almost eight times 
the amount of money they gave Republicans. This 
disproportionate financial support could indicate motivation 
for the alleged viewpoint discrimination against conservative 
media.
    At Independent Women's Forum and our sister 501(c)(4) 
organization, Independent Women's Voice, we rely heavily on 
digital tools to reach our audiences. Last year we witnessed 
suppression over political differences from tech platform 
Eventbrite. Eventbrite banned our page, Let Women Speak, 
organized by our IWN Austin chapter. Eventbrite claimed we 
violated community guidelines for perpetuating hate speech. 
Eventbrite believes in silencing women's voices in the high 
stakes national conversation on protecting female safety in 
sports, prisons, and battered women's shelters.
    While IWN has no evidence, the government pressured 
Eventbrite to remove our event, it is worth noting two 
important facts: First, IWF has is vocally and visibly opposed 
to the Biden administration's illegal rewrite of Title IX's 
protections for women, prohibiting sex-based discrimination.
    Second, the Sixth Circuit Court of Appeals ruled the Biden 
administration violated the First Amendment by pressuring 
technology companies to suppress or remove social media posts.
    In conclusion, America cannot function as a healthy 
republic without freedom of speech. Commercial freedom and 
freedom of expression go hand in hand. As the Supreme Court has 
noted for more than a century, businesses are voices for 
people.
    I am grateful to this committee for investigating this 
issue and look forward to working with your team in the days 
ahead to ensure a robust marketplace of ideas flourishes in 
America.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The lady yields back. And I now 
recognize Dr. Franks for her 5-minute opening remarks.

               STATEMENT OF DR. MARY ANNE FRANKS

    Ms. FRANKS. Thank you. As noted in my introduction, I am a 
law professor at the George Washington Law School, and I 
specialize in the intersection of the First Amendment 
Technology and Civil rights. I am also the president of the 
Cyber Civil Rights Initiative, which is the leading U.S. 
nonprofit organization focused on combating image-based sexual 
abuse.
    I am speaking only on my own behalf today. I am drawing on 
the expertise that I have developed in both of these roles to 
offer explanations of settled First Amendment doctrine, and to 
emphasize how harassment and intimidation campaigns against 
misinformation researchers, especially when it is instigated by 
government officials, chill freedom of expression and 
jeopardize national security.
    The First Amendment, broadly speaking, protects speech from 
government suppression. It does not protect speech from 
criticism or competition. It does not guarantee any speaker a 
platform or a profit. The same First Amendment that protects 
one person's right to speak also protects the right of another 
person to reject, to discredit, or ignore that speech.
    The fact that critical speech may lead to negative 
consequences for those who are criticized, such as a decline in 
popularity or in revenue merely indicates that the speech is 
effective, not that it is censorship.
    Competition is not censorship. Counterspeech is not 
censorship. Research is not censorship. Providing information 
to businesses about other businesses is not censorship.
    Efforts to convince consumers, advertisers, and the public 
that certain content is false, is fraudulent, harmful, 
extremist, harassing or exploitative, is not censorship.
    None of this changes just because the government may have 
provided funding for the speech in question. While the Supreme 
Court has held that ``government officials cannot attempt to 
coerce private parties in order to punish or suppress views 
that the government disfavors,'' the government is allowed to 
speak on its own behalf, and to take sides in controversial 
matters.
    The government is allowed, for example, to promote military 
enlistment and war bonds during wartime without also having to 
promote messages that discourage those efforts. The government 
is allowed to fund certain messages or perspectives and not 
others.
    In the 1991 case of Rust v. Sullivan, Chief Justice 
Rehnquist, writing for the majority, stated that the First 
Amendment allows the government ``to selectively fund a program 
to encourage certain activities it believes to be in the public 
interest, without at the same time funding an alternative 
program, which seeks to deal with the problem in another way.''
    The individuals, organizations, and research institutions 
that are fighting to maintain the integrity of our elections, 
our public health systems, our information ecosystem, are 
speakers, not censors. Their speech is more urgently needed now 
than ever as we face unprecedented threats to our democracy 
from both outside and inside the United States.
    If there were any doubt as to the significance of this 
speech, it has been dispelled by the increasingly desperate and 
aggressive attempts to silence it. Misinformation researchers 
have been vilified, defunded, harassed, and threatened, 
including by Members of Congress--government officials using 
taxpayer dollars to instigate hearings, subpoenas, lawsuits, 
document requests, and investigations to literally shut down 
speech that they do not like. And unlike the federal funding 
programs attacked in this hearing, these actions by government 
officials are not merely encouraging speech that they prefer, 
but punishing the speech that they fear.
    These efforts have been chillingly effective. It was 
announced recently that the Stanford Internet Observatory, a 
cross-disciplinary program that provided in-depth analyses of 
social media's role in child exploitation and the spread of 
false information about elections and vaccines ``may shut down 
amid the political and legal attacks that have,'' as The 
Washington Post says, ``cast a pall on efforts to study online 
misinformation,'' attacks that have included ``lawsuits, 
document requests and threats of physical harm,'' including the 
targeting of student volunteers.
    This is what censorship looks like: Government-led efforts 
to directly suppress disfavored speech as well as to leverage 
third parties to assist in those efforts. The harassment and 
silencing of misinformation researchers, especially in a year 
when a record-breaking number of elections will take place 
around the world, threatens free speech and democracy on 
unprecedented scale.
    If Congress genuinely wants to address the threat of 
censorship, it should start by acknowledging that the call is 
coming from inside the House. Thank you.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The lady yields back. As I mentioned at 
the beginning, the committee--they have called for votes. So we 
will take a brief recess until 11:15, and we will reconvene and 
begin the questions. So thank you.
    [Recess.]
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The committee will now come to order. We 
will now move to the Member questions under the 5-minute rule. 
And I want to thank all of you for bearing with us as we voted. 
I now recognize myself for 5 minutes.
    We heard in the Ranking Member's opening statement that 
there is no evidence of government censorship affecting small 
businesses. However, three of our witnesses' testimony seem to 
negate that assertation.
    Additionally, we heard from Dr. Franks that this hearing is 
meant to harass research groups and universities. This is 
simply not true. We are asking for transparency to ensure that 
taxpayer dollars are not being weaponized to silence political 
opponents. Also, our committee has only sent letters to federal 
agencies, no universities, or other private actors. This is a 
textbook congressional oversight.
    Now, though, through our investigation, we have seen 
hundreds of awards that have been given through the SBIR 
programs to companies who claim to be disinformation experts to 
police the internet and interfere with Americans' right to free 
speech.
    One of these examples is NewsGuard. NewsGuard is multiple 
products, one of which uses politicized metrics to rate the 
media outlets based on their supposed credibility. And if 
NewsGuard claims an organization is not credible, their 
advertising revenue is severely affected. NewsGuard is 
reportedly rated around 10,000 media outlets, many of them 
small and medium businesses.
    So Ms. Younes, can you tell us more about how NewsGuard 
operates and how they impact the ability of businesses to earn 
revenue. And why it is a problem that the federal government is 
giving these kind of companies money?
    Ms. YOUNES. So NewsGuard rates media companies based on 
their ostensible reliability. And that has the effect of 
driving advertiser revenue away from them if their rank is 
unreliable.
    Now, I believe that GDI is even worse than NewsGuard. And 
their secret blacklist was actually revealed sometime before we 
started this litigation and was part of the reason we actually 
did. And their secret blacklist showed that all of the sites 
that they ranked were reliable were liberal, including, you 
know, websites such as The Huffington Post, which I would argue 
don't really engage in the most journalistic practices of the 
highest integrity. And all of the ones that they deemed 
unreliable were conservative. So really shows that this is 
viewpoint discrimination. Not to mention the fact that the GEC 
shouldn't be funding any of this at all, because their mandate 
is to deal with foreign so-called disinformation. And these are 
domestic news sites that they are ranking.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Thank you. NewsGuard and companies like 
them don't just impact the businesses. They rate small 
businesses. They are not large enough to have an internal 
advertising department often partnered with advertising 
companies to help get their products or services out to the 
public. Many of these advertising companies look at the ratings 
that NewsGuard gives media companies when deciding where to 
place a small business ad.
    So, Ms. Sheffield, if I am a small business owner, which I 
actually am in Texas, and looking to place advertisements to 
online--to a conservative audience. But the advertising partner 
I am working with is partnered with a company like NewsGuard, 
am I going to have issues reaching out to the audiences I need 
to reach out to?
    Ms. SHEFFIELD. Well, so in the industry, there is a term 
called ``brand safe.'' And a lot of times, especially for a 
small startup or a medium-sized business, a lot of these big 
brands, like, say, Nike, or some of the bigger marquis brands, 
they are not going to be familiar with smaller startups. And 
so, they rely on some third parties to determine whether or not 
this organization or this media outlet is quote, unquote 
``brand safe.'' And that brand safe designation can really make 
or break the future of a business.
    As I said earlier in my testimony, that 40 percent of small 
and medium business publishers say that digital ad sales drive 
over half of their overall revenue. So this could be the death 
knell if they are not considered brand safe.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Okay. Mr. Weingarten, in the limited 
time that we have, over the course of our investigation, we 
found that so-called fact-checking organizations are being used 
to bolster traditional media outlets by labeling others, often 
small- and medium-sized outlets as untrustworthy if they 
question the accepted narratives. So this creates a conflict of 
interest for many news organizations; either get in line and 
stop asking tough questions, or lose out on advertising 
revenue, potentially get out of the business.
    So based on the output of Newsguard's and similar 
companies' ratings, which narratives do you see being silenced, 
and do you think this is a creating an environment where those 
in power are not being held accountable?
    Mr. WEINGARTEN. I think there is substantial evidence to 
suggest that views, for example, with respect to virtually 
every aspect of COVID-19 from origins to mitigation measures 
would lead a site to get downgraded to the extent they took 
positions that were antithetical to those of public health 
authorities. We have also seen this as well with respect to the 
war in Ukraine.
    And I think what is so chilling about this ultimately is if 
this entire disinformation, counter-disinformation--so-called 
ecosystem existed in and of itself without any sort of 
government backing, I think we would probably still find it 
objectionable, but we would say there is a First Amendment 
right to it, it is protected.
    The problem here is that government is conferring its 
blessing on this entire ecosystem, which clearly exists to 
chill speech officials don't like.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Thank you. And I now recognize the 
Ranking Member for 5 minutes of questions.
    Ms. VELAZQUEZ. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    Dr. Franks, have you seen any evidence that ties money from 
federal awards to the ratings of American media outlets by GDI?
    Ms. FRANKS. I have not.
    Ms. VELAZQUEZ. In recent testimony, you highlight the real-
world consequences of the investigations launched by 
Congressional Republicans, that by the way, are basically 
partisans. For instance, according to your subpoena, you asked 
for any awards related to the National Democratic Institute and 
the role combating misinformation overseas. Yet your subpoena 
voids asking for any records related to the International 
Republican Institute, which does similar work overseas, and has 
also gotten awards from GEC. Let's be serious about this issue.
    Dr. Franks, can you discuss how this investigation, the 
legal expenses they create, and harassment they invite can have 
a chilling effect on the legitimate political speech of 
individuals?
    Ms. FRANKS. Yes, particularly through the use of things 
like very burdensome subpoenas, as you have mentioned, invasive 
record requests for massive amounts of private communications, 
work product, including student volunteers, in some cases, 
demands for closed-door interrogations of researchers, 
expensive lawsuits that take not only money, but time away from 
researchers and their important work. Those who are involved in 
these investigations have, at times, lied about researchers' 
work, have vilified them in the press.
    They have made false accusations about them on social 
media, which has led to extensive harassment and threats by 
online mobs who have published their private information in 
some cases, have expressed threats against their family 
members, and made many of these researchers fear for their 
safety. And in response, many of those individuals have closed 
down their social media accounts entirely. They have canceled 
speaking engagements, they have withdrawn from their work, they 
have withdrawn from civic participation. And this is, in fact, 
what it looks like to see government coercion and actual 
silencing.
    Ms. VELAZQUEZ. Thank you. Mechanisms that protect our 
national security are being threatened, while organizations 
that combat misinformation by our adversaries are shutting 
down. Can you broadly discuss the spread of information warfare 
from our adversaries, specifically during this upcoming 
election season?
    Ms. FRANKS. Broadly speaking, information warfare really 
thrives on social tensions, it thrives on misinformation, it 
thrives on a polluted information ecosystem. And so, when we 
are concerned about foreign interference with our elections and 
other processes, we have to be concerned about the integrity of 
that information environment. And so the attempts to shut down 
research on mis- and disinformation makes us more vulnerable to 
those kinds of attacks. And these kinds of threats are only 
escalating with the advancement of AI.
    We have already seen evidence that AI is being used by 
foreign sources to make their campaigns of disinformation and 
misinformation and sowing political division even more 
effective.
    Ms. VELAZQUEZ. Social media algorithms tend to promote 
content that is sensational or divisive, because those posts 
tend to drive more engagement. If advertisers choose to 
withdraw their ads from posts because they do not want to be 
associated with the message, is that censorship?
    Ms. FRANKS. It is not censorship, and it is, in fact, quite 
the opposite. It is the First Amendment protected right to 
choose to disassociate from speech with which you disagree.
    Ms. VELAZQUEZ. Is there any evidence of social media 
algorithms favoring one political viewpoint over another?
    Ms. FRANKS. To the extent that there is evidence of 
partisan special treatment, that actually runs in the opposite 
direction. There have been multiple studies conducted by social 
media platforms and others that have indicated that, in fact, 
it is conservative speech, right-wing speech, that receives 
preferential treatment. And that even at times Meta, for 
instance, on its Facebook service decided to change its 
algorithm so that it could boost right-wing content over left-
wing content.
    Ms. VELAZQUEZ. In my colleagues' quest to be the ultimate 
victim, they often come close to recognizing a real problem, 
the power of the counsel of social media platforms to control 
what is essentially the entire information flow in the country.
    What material steps could we take to enrich competition in 
social media and create more transparency among them?
    Ms. FRANKS. If we are really concerned about that 
conglomeration, that consolidation of power in these few 
companies, one of the first things we would need to do is to 
reform Section 230(C)(1), which is providing just absolutely 
unconscionable amount of immunity to social media platforms for 
engaging in harmful facilitation of content.
    We could also encourage the Federal Trade Commission to do 
more oversight and regulation of unfair and deceptive 
practices. And we could also provide funding for local media, 
for other news sources, for other kinds of interactions that 
people could engage in for specific participation in public 
discourse.
    Ms. VELAZQUEZ. Thank you. I yield back.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back. I now 
recognize Representative Meuser from the great State of 
Pennsylvania for 5 minutes.
    Mr. MEUSER. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And thank you to our 
witnesses as well. You know, interesting and disturbing at the 
same time. All right. We appreciate the honesty of how there 
are those on this panel that feel that government has the right 
to choose what information should be permitted to be published 
on social media.
    Now certainly, I think we agree at a private sector or the 
confines of your own home or just personally, you can choose 
not to read a particular newspaper or choose not to provide 
information to your children, and the private sector within a 
business. But the government, the United States Government has 
the right to pull information that it disagrees with? Am I 
hearing this right?
    Ms. Franks, we are going to get to that. Are we actually 
hearing that right?
    So let me ask you this. Thank you again for your honesty. 
So let me--Ms. Sheffield, the advertisers are being pushed from 
free speech platforms. Can you discuss how those censorship 
efforts are affecting, you know, the implications for your 
small businesses?
    Ms. SHEFFIELD. Yes, as we have heard from my colleague and 
also from litigation from other outlets and in my personal 
experience, whether it is investors or advertisers, there is 
certainly a perception that if you lean a certain way, that if 
you have populous impulses, that somehow you are not considered 
brand safe.
    Mr. MEUSER. So in Title IX, you mentioned something about 
Title IX. So if I believe in Title IX and boys shouldn't be 
playing girls' sports, I could be censored?
    Ms. SHEFFIELD. Absolutely. And in our case, we were 
censored by the tech platform Eventbrite----
    Mr. MEUSER. Right.
    Ms. SHEFFIELD.--which removed our event which allowed women 
to speak----
    Mr. MEUSER. Right.
    Ms. SHEFFIELD.--about sexual assault and their concern with 
being forced to be----
    Mr. MEUSER. Thank you.
    Ms. SHEFFIELD.--placed in the----
    Mr. MEUSER. And, Ms. Franks, do you think that is wrong?
    Ms. FRANKS. You asked the question of whether or not you 
had it right, if you are hearing this correctly. And I would 
say, no, you are not, if what you are saying----
    Mr. MEUSER. Unless specifically--is Ms. Sheffield wrong in 
what she just said?
    Ms. FRANKS. I am not entirely clear what point was being 
made there.
    Mr. MEUSER. Okay. Then we will move on.
    Ms. FRANKS. But you did ask whether or not you were hearing 
correctly. I do just want to say that, no, what I was 
suggesting was not my feeling about the law, this is, in fact, 
the statement of the law.
    Mr. MEUSER. And you were pretty clear. I am going to 
reclaim my time. Mr. Weingarten?
    Ms. FRANKS. That First Amendment actually does allow the 
government to express its own viewpoints, but it does not of 
course allow it to silence a dissent----
    Mr. MEUSER. You cited Rehnquist, okay? Rehnquist decision, 
and the draft was taking place. Okay. Rehnquist decision would 
not have suppressed or censored anyone online or putting up a 
billboard that said, I am against the draft. You are suggesting 
that would be appropriate by the government and that is dead 
wrong.
    Ms. FRANKS. I am suggesting that words mean something, and 
the words ``silencing'' and ``censoring'' mean something.
    Mr. MEUSER. No----
    Ms. FRANKS. These websites have not----
    Mr. MEUSER. Counter speech. That's what we call it, and 
that is what the schools have called it.
    Ms. FRANKS.--they have not been confined. They have not 
been imprisoned. They have not been----
    Mr. MEUSER. That is what we call it, and that is what the 
schools have called it. And that was what is appropriate, 
counter speech, diversity in ideas and discussion.
    Ms. FRANKS. Exactly what the GDI is providing, yes.
    Mr. MEUSER. Is that what the GDI is providing, Mr. 
Weingarten?
    Mr. WEINGARTEN. The government has the bully pulpit and a 
whole slew of other tools to express its viewpoint. Funding 
entities that exist to bankrupt media companies that propagate 
dissenting viewpoints, expressly, to me is un-American, 
unconstitutional, and frankly just wrong on its face.
    Mr. MEUSER. They have labeled you all in pretty nasty 
terms. They labeled real clear--almost risky and untrustworthy 
media outlets impacted operations--to impact your operations 
and revenues. Do you want to talk about that a minute?
    Mr. WEINGARTEN. Well, first, it bears noting that when a 
NewsGuard comes to you with the rating that it does, it does so 
with the backing of one of its largest investors, which is a 
major ad, PR company representing major clients, including the 
likes of, for example, Pfizer, pharmaceutical companies. And it 
does so with advisors that include the former head of the State 
Department's Global Engagement Center, the former head of CIA, 
NSA, as well as the former Homeland Security advisor.
    So when it does so, it is a big deal for you to be 
tarnished and your reputation to be attacked with very little 
recourse against it on seemingly subjective grounds.
    Mr. MEUSER. Not by a competitor, by the government.
    Mr. WEINGARTEN. De facto.
    Mr. MEUSER. De facto, okay. Ms. Younes, how has 
government's involvement using taxpayer dollars, okay, my 
dollars, my constituent's dollars to interfere with the ability 
of small businesses to compete online because of--because they 
may have questioned the origins of COVID, because they feel 
immunity when COVID was there might be comparable to getting 
the vaccine--or they have concerns about the vaccine, or they 
believe in Title IX, or they have other beliefs that maybe this 
administration doesn't agree with. How does that hurt small 
business?
    Ms. YOUNES. It drives revenue away, and it interferes with 
our ability to reach the public, which they have a First 
Amendment right to do as the press.
    Mr. MEUSER. My time has expired. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields. I now recognize 
Representative Landsman from the great State of Ohio for 5 
minutes.
    Mr. LANDSMAN. Thank you, Mr. Chair. The Court did rule as 
we were sitting here, or earlier, in favor of the 
administration. The Supreme Court on Wednesday rejected a 
Republican-led effort to sharply limit White House officials 
and other federal employees from pressuring social media 
companies to remove posts from their platforms that the U.S. 
Government deems problematic. In a 6-3 ruling, the court said 
the challengers did not have legal grounds or standing to bring 
the case against the Biden administration because the States 
and individuals could not show that they were directly harmed 
by the communications between federal officials and social 
media platforms.
    Writing for the majority, Justice Amy Coney Barrett said 
companies like Facebook and YouTube have longstanding content 
moderation policies that place warning labels on certain posts 
and delete others. The challengers, Barrett wrote, did not 
demonstrate the company's actions to remove posts that were 
traceable to the government. These lead me to a couple of 
questions. One is the Court has spoken.
    Just to clarify, let's start with warning labels. The 
government has said that cigarette companies have to put--
tobacco companies have to put warning labels on their products 
because it causes cancer. And this is just a yes or no 
question. I just--Ms. Younes, do you oppose those warning 
labels?
    Ms. YOUNES. No.
    Mr. LANDSMAN. Okay. Mr. Weingarten, do you oppose those 
warning labels?
    Mr. WEINGARTEN. No.
    Mr. LANDSMAN. Ms. Sheffield, do you oppose those warning 
labels?
    Ms. SHEFFIELD. I don't think it is applicable here, but----
    Mr. LANDSMAN. Yes or no?
    Ms. SHEFFIELD. It is apples or oranges, but no.
    Mr. LANDSMAN. Good. Ms. Franks?
    Ms. FRANKS. No, I do not oppose it.
    Mr. LANDSMAN. Now, here we will get to something a little 
bit more applicable, Ms. Sheffield. Sheffield?
    Ms. SHEFFIELD. Sheffield, yes, Like ``The Nanny.''
    Mr. LANDSMAN. Yeah. During the thirties and forties, 
Hitler's Nazi Government used propaganda, not just in Germany, 
but here in the United States, as you are aware. One of the 
leading causes of drivers of anti-Semitism and ultimately 
horrible events, including the Holocaust has been blood libel, 
including this lie that Jews killed Jesus.
    Let's say, as they did in the thirties and forties, that 
the Nazi Government was paying for content on platforms that 
Jews killed Jesus and that they needed to be round up. Would 
you have a problem, Ms. Younes, if the government pulled that 
content?
    Ms. YOUNES. I am sorry, who is putting the content up?
    Mr. LANDSMAN. Well, this was content that was put up and 
distributed throughout the United States in the 1930s and early 
'40s. And so, if similar content was put out on media platform 
now, yes or no, do you have a problem?
    Ms. YOUNES. I do not think that the government should be 
involved in censoring that. I think that counter speech is the 
appropriate way to go.
    Mr. LANDSMAN. So in this case, it is fine, Jews killed 
Jesus, round them up, you can keep it. Mr. Weingarten?
    Mr. WEINGARTEN. Well, I'd want to think more about the 
hypothetical. What I think is inapt to this is you are talking 
about foreign-funded on domestic platforms.
    Mr. LANDSMAN. Right, we don't----
    Mr. WEINGARTEN. We are also talking about an enemy regime, 
not American speech on issues that are politically----
    Mr. LANDSMAN. Foreign adversaries don't pay for this by 
saying, Hey, we are paying for this. We don't know who is 
paying for the content.
    Ms. Sheffield, yes or no? Are you okay with this or no?
    Ms. SHEFFIELD. This hearing is about the Global Engagement 
Center, which is the U.S. State Department and whether or not 
they spent U.S. tax dollars to suppress American citizens. The 
analogy is clearly irrelevant.
    Mr. LANDSMAN. Ms. Franks, you would agree that that content 
needed to be removed?
    Ms. FRANKS. I believe that if the government made the 
choice that it wanted to assist organizations in countering 
that message, or suggesting that there were tools that could be 
used so that that message could be countered with truthful and 
factual information, that that would be acceptable.
    Mr. LANDSMAN. I think that's right. Ms. Sheffield, your 
beef is with Eventbrite. I mean, you are frustrated because 
Eventbrite thought that promoting an event that bullied 
children was a problem. That is how they saw it. It is a 
private company. Did you take them to court?
    Ms. SHEFFIELD. We requested them to reinstate our event, 
and they chose not to respond. But again, that is just one of 
numerous----
    Mr. LANDSMAN. And did you take them to court?
    Ms. SHEFFIELD. We have waited--we sent out a message to 
them. We waited for a response. The event has already passed. 
But again, this--the question is----
    Mr. LANDSMAN. But you could if you wanted to. You have 
access to the criminal justice system, the court system. You 
can take them to court.
    Ms. SHEFFIELD. We could.
    Mr. LANDSMAN. Okay.
    Ms. SHEFFIELD. And, in fact, we actually are taking the 
Biden administration to court for its illegal rewrite of Title 
IX.
    Mr. LANDSMAN. Just be careful because the Supreme Court 
just said, I wouldn't do that. Thank you, and I yield back.
    Ms. SHEFFIELD. The Supreme Court just said this was not 
based on----
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back. The time is 
up. I now recognize Representative Van Duyne from the great 
State of Texas for her 5 minutes.
    Ms. VAN DUYNE. Thank you very much. Mr. Landsman just 
quotes from today's SCOTUS opinion. But it is important to 
highlight exactly what you were saying, that neither the 
individual nor the State plaintiffs have established Article 3, 
which is standing. It doesn't mean that they do not have 
standing to sue. This is not a decision based on the merits.
    Ms. Younes, you are our constitutional--can you give us 
some clarity on this?
    Ms. YOUNES. Sure. Actually, I am one of the lawyers on the 
case, so I know it well. This was also limited to the 
preliminary injunction. They said because a preliminary 
injunction is about forward-looking relief, and they hadn't--
the plaintiffs hadn't established a likelihood that they would 
be harmed in the future because some of these programs appeared 
to be ending.
    So this is not about the merits. The court actually 
specifically said it was not expressing the views to the 
merits. The case will continue in the district court. And I 
suppose that is essentially the issue is this is limited to the 
preliminary injunction. They are not saying that the government 
didn't do anything wrong.
    Ms. VAN DUYNE. Thank you for clarifying that. I wanted to 
make sure that that was clarified and not just cut off. The 
State Department's so-called Global Engagement Center which is 
exactly what we are here to talk about today had spent millions 
of taxpayer dollars to silence American small businesses who do 
not share their liberal, political beliefs.
    The CEO of the Global Disinformation Index even admitted 
that this list has, quote, ``significant impact on the 
advertising revenue,'' unquote, on the companies, showing that 
they are knowingly attempting to destroy livelihoods of those 
with which they disagree.
    Meanwhile, the Global Disinformation Index scores NPR as 
one of the least risky outlets, citing as quote, ``neutral, 
fact-based content.'' Contradicting GDI's rating, an NPR 
staffer who worked there for 25 years wrote about his 
experiences at NPR, and highlighted the level of bias that GDI 
failed to recognize. This article said that when stories NPR 
labeled as disinformation turned out to be credible, such as 
the legitimacy of the Hunter Biden laptop and the COVID-19 lab 
leak theory, that NPR quote, ``pretended it never happened and 
performed no self-reflection.''
    Mr. Chairman, I ask for unanimous consent to enter the full 
article into the record.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. No objection.
    Ms. VAN DUYNE. The Biden administration has pledged to be 
the most transparent administration in history. But instead, we 
found that they have been stonewalling our requests time and 
time again because they know exactly what they are doing, and 
they are using improper use of taxpayer funds, if not 
completely unethical and illegal.
    We will continue to expose this administration's extremist 
agenda and their lawless acts as we work to provide 
accountability for American small businesses.
    I was stunned, Ms. Franks, that you had to say that, Oh, 
they haven't been imprisoned. Is that now the bar that we are 
setting? So we are fine bankrupting these businesses, we are 
fine blacklisting them, we are fine shutting them down, and 
silencing their voice, but at least they are not being 
imprisoned yet.
    Ms. FRANKS. Sorry, was that a question for me?
    Ms. VAN DUYNE. No, it is not a question. I am just 
flabbergasted at your statement.
    Ms. FRANKS. I misunderstood----
    Ms. VAN DUYNE. Mr. Weingarten, do you think the Global 
Disinformation Index is a fair assessment?
    Mr. WEINGARTEN. I don't, but even if it was, the government 
shouldn't be funding it.
    Ms. VAN DUYNE. So given that opinions are often difficult 
to separate from fact and that facts evolve over time, would it 
even be possible to assess the accuracy of a media outlet in a 
truly objective fashion?
    Mr. WEINGARTEN. It is an inherently subjective exercise--as 
outlets put out news and views that are varying. And to have 
some sort of ``ministry of truth,'' or ``ministries of truth'' 
out there with the government's blessing is incredibly 
chilling.
    Ms. VAN DUYNE. So why is it an issue that the federal 
government is funding supposed fact-checking organizations?
    Mr. WEINGARTEN. Because effectively, this amounts to 
abridging of speech by proxy. Even if you couldn't draw a 
straight line from a government official saying ``Take down X, 
Y, Z speech,'' the government is effectively giving its 
blessing through its funding to these entities, which exist to 
put out of business, some entities, and also, by the way, 
effectively provide a subsidy to the protected whitelisted 
publications as well.
    So it is a dual-edged sword. It is picking winners and 
losers de facto with government funding.
    Ms. VAN DUYNE. But it is picking winners and losers based 
on what?
    Mr. WEINGARTEN. Well, it seems clear when you look at the 
breakdowns of how the scores come out based upon ideology. 
Viewpoint--diversity is antithetical it seems to these 
entities.
    Ms. VAN DUYNE. So Ms. Franks said that typically what 
happens is it benefits conservative news outlets. Has that been 
your experience? Is that what you have seen?
    Mr. WEINGARTEN. We have seen ratings to suggest--
NewsGuard's ratings reviewed--large samples of both right-
leaning and left-leaning publications, and it comes out that 
the left-leaning publications rank substantially higher, 25-
plus points higher on NewsGuard's 100-point scale than right-
leaning publications.
    Ms. VAN DUYNE. Can you give any examples of right-wing 
publications that they have disparaged?
    Mr. WEINGARTEN. Well, they cast, I guess, RealClearPolitics 
and RealClearInvestigations, as having an undisclosed 
conservative bias. But, of course, this includes the 
Federalist, I think probably well The Daily Wire, Townhall, I 
believe, a slew of other so-called right-wing leaning entities 
as well.
    Ms. VAN DUYNE. Excellent. Thank you, and I yield.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back. Now I 
recognize Representative Crane from the great State of Arizona 
for 5 minutes.
    Mr. CRANE. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I appreciate the 
hearing today.
    I want to start with you, Ms. Franks. I believe you said 
the government has the right to participate in expressing its 
viewpoint. Is that what you said?
    Ms. FRANKS. Yes.
    Mr. CRANE. I don't--respectfully, Ms. Franks, I don't think 
that is what we are really talking about here today. We are not 
talking about the government expressing its viewpoints. What we 
are really talking about is when the government pays and uses 
taxpayer dollars to fund these entities that we are talking 
about here today that actually discredit some of these news 
sites, and drives away their advertisers. Do you think that is 
fair as well?
    Ms. FRANKS. What is fair is for the government to be able 
to fund projects and organizations that do certain things with 
those funds that may include competing in the marketplace of 
ideas, and they may be winning in the marketplace of ideas. But 
the government is not making those choices. And when certain 
news outlets lose in the marketplace of ideas, they may want to 
blame the government for that, but maybe they are just losers.
    Mr. CRANE. So--okay. Ms. Franks, do you think----
    Ms. FRANKS. It is actually Dr. Franks.
    Mr. CRANE. Okay. Dr. Franks, sorry. Ms. Younes here said 
that when she was looking at these entities and the 
organizations that they have blacklisted, every single one of 
them was a conservative-leaning organization. Do you think that 
is fair as well? Is that okay, Dr. Franks?
    Ms. FRANKS. You used a different name, so I wasn't sure you 
were talking to me.
    Mr. CRANE. Yeah, I am still talking to you. I am still 
looking at you. I am still talking to you.
    Ms. FRANKS. Would you repeat the question for me.
    Mr. CRANE. Yeah. You seem to have a problem paying 
attention to the questions being asked of you today. I will 
repeat it for you again. Do you think that it is okay that 
these entities that are blacklisting companies, all of the 
companies on the list that are blacklisted are conservative 
outlets?
    Ms. FRANKS. Do I think that it is okay for a company, for a 
nonprofit organization to develop tools that offer rankings? In 
other words, offer speech of criticism, critical speech about 
certain businesses? Yes, I think that is okay, because that is 
protected First Amendment activity.
    Mr. CRANE. So you think it is okay for the federal 
government to be using our tax dollars to basically, through a 
proxy, blacklist one side of the aisle? You think that is okay?
    Ms. FRANKS. I do not, because that is not what is 
happening.
    Mr. CRANE. Really? How so?
    Ms. FRANKS. Yes. Because----
    Mr. CRANE. Then why are all the companies on the list, the 
blacklist, conservative groups?
    Ms. FRANKS. I think that is something the conservatives 
would need to answer.
    Mr. CRANE. No. I think that is something you need to 
answer.
    Ms. FRANKS. I am not working with any of these companies.
    Mr. CRANE. Because we are talking about censorship here and 
there is only one group of people being censored.
    Ms. FRANKS. No one is being censored according to----
    Mr. CRANE. Ms. Younes here admitted she is not even a 
Republican. She leans left. Yet she is telling us that all of 
the companies on the blacklist are conservative groups. How do 
you square that, Doctor?
    Ms. FRANKS. I don't have to square that, because, as I 
said, the focus here----
    Mr. CRANE. I know, because you don't have to make any 
sense, do you?
    Ms. FRANKS. May I answer the question?
    Mr. CRANE. Yeah, go ahead.
    Ms. FRANKS. The First Amendment has certain principles and 
certain rules. People may not like them. People may disagree 
with them. People may not like the fact that someone out there 
may say conservatives are all bad or liberals are all bad. The 
correct response to not liking that is to engage in your own 
speech, as is often happening here. It is not to say, Oh, this 
is censorship, we are being silenced. It is simply to say we 
disagree with what is being said here. Try to compete, and if 
you are good enough, maybe you will win.
    Mr. CRANE. Ms. Younes, what do you have to say about what 
Dr. Franks just said?
    Ms. YOUNES. I want to be clear that this wasn't just about 
NewsGuard and GDI. The government was funding hundreds, at 
least 300 tools and technologies that were designed to censor 
speech. Some of them weren't even pretending to censor foreign 
disinformation, quote, unquote. ``Disinformation.'' Of course, 
that is a subjective term. They were hosting COVID 
disinformation challenges where they were giving grants to 
companies who showed that they were the best at censoring COVID 
disinformation. COVID is not really a national security or 
foreign topic, even if it has some tinges of that.
    So this was about the government using its authority--the 
government can't use its authority, can't use its power, and 
can't use its money in order to censor views it doesn't like. 
It is the government. Yes, it has a right to censor--sorry, to 
express its own views, but not to use those views to censor. 
That is where it stops. And the Court expressly said that in 
Vullo recently actually.
    Mr. CRANE. Mr. Weingarten, I am going to allow you to 
comment on this exchange.
    Mr. WEINGARTEN. I would just say briefly we have heard a 
robust defense of the government's purported right to speak, 
which is we have established, really looks like a right to 
censor, and the censor is portrayed as the victims here. But 
Americans' speech, en masse, has been censored by this 
Censorship-Industrial Complex on a slew of issues that 
expressly reflect protected political speech, and if a stop 
isn't put to it, we are going to lose this right in toto.
    Mr. CRANE. Thank you.
    Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Gentleman yields back. I now recognize 
Representative Bean from the great State of Florida for 5 
minutes.
    Mr. BEAN. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. Good morning 
to you, and good morning, Small Business Committee. For 237 
years, our nation has been the beacon, the shining example of 
freedom around the world. Other nations look to us with envy. 
The cornerstone of that freedom is our First Amendment freedom 
of the--freedom of the press, freedom of speech, what is one of 
the many things that separates America from the rest of the 
world. Hopefully, America is watching.
    America, are you watching? Because thanks to the 
congressional investigations by the Judiciary Committee, we now 
know the Biden administration has been undermining freedom of 
the press and freedom of the speech almost since they took 
office.
    Here is how they do it. Here is the recipe to undermine 
Americans' right to know. They push big tech to change their 
terms of service, to fit the administration's agenda. One such 
company was Amazon. We have got the smoking gun evidence right 
here. On March 12th, 2021, Biden at the White House emailed 
Amazon's vice president of public policy about the high levels 
of propaganda and misinformation and disinformation at Amazon.
    They continued to pressure Amazon to give warnings about 
anybody questioning the COVID vaccines, but that was not 
enough. They continued to press them on taking these books out 
of reach, or even just making them disappear. Thousands of 
books about the vaccine were disappeared overnight.
    Still not enough. They continued to press them. We have got 
the memos. They continued to press Amazon to put something 
called ``do not promote'' designation under the table at 
Amazon, and then another 43 books that questioned the vaccine 
just disappeared.
    If you are going to sell anything, America looks to Amazon 
as it is the largest bookstore in our nation, and it has a 
drastic effect on getting the word out.
    So I will start with Ms. Sheffield. How important is it 
that an author to have access to sell books on Amazon? Is that 
a big deal?
    Ms. SHEFFIELD. It is huge. It is the largest book seller, 
and as I mentioned in my opening remarks, the FTC under Lina 
Khan, the Biden administration has sought to basically suppress 
authors from being allowed to offer their books at the lowest 
price, and it is an Orwellian attempt to destroy what is known 
as the consumer welfare standard, and the consumer welfare 
standard has been the bedrock of competition in this country 
for decades, and it is truly troubling that Lina Khan believes 
that she can be a rogue actor, and she keeps getting swatted 
down in the courts repeatedly. That is the only silver lining 
of her actions.
    Mr. BEAN. So it is a big deal is your answer. It is a big 
deal and it stifles free speech. It does stifle free speech. Do 
you find it ironic that the Biden administration pointed the 
finger at States like my State, the free State of Florida, for 
removing porn, pornographic materials from elementary schools, 
yet they actually went to Amazon to have these books secretly 
removed? Do you find honor--irony in that, Ms. Sheffield?
    Ms. SHEFFIELD. Oh, absolutely. I mean, it--but it is also 
not surprising from this administration that we see over and 
over the overreach of government to suppress speech. It is 
interesting this Congressman----
    Mr. BEAN. Let's just do this, because I have got more 
questions to get to. Let the record reflect the witness says 
yes, it is very ironic.
    Here is how they did it, too. America, are you still 
listening? Because they used something called NewsGuard and 
then they get to pick and choose what sources, what news. If 
you like them, they'll promote you, and if they don't like you 
through NewsGuard, then they can bankrupt you, they can label 
you disinformation, and it is shocking. It should be shocking 
to you, America.
    But how about this? It also concerns me the NewsGuard is 
partnered with the American Federation of Teachers, the largest 
teachers' union, 1.7 million teachers now have NewsGuard in 
their classrooms where their news is chosen for them. It means 
that students using NewsGuard are told generally conservative 
outlets cannot be trusted, yet they should put their faith in 
organizations, legacy media, like The New York Times. We 
don't--we know about The New York Times. It doesn't have--there 
is a bias. We all know there is a bias.
    Our students are indoctrinated not to trust outlets based 
on NewsGuard's partisan ratings, and if you don't get the good 
ratings, then you are not trusted and no one wants to advertise 
or go there.
    So Mr. Weingarten, does it worry you that students are 
being told that outlets such as RealClear and other media 
outlets cannot be trusted? Does that bother you?
    Mr. WEINGARTEN. It is troublesome, and particularly given 
that media literacy education is starting to be mandated in a 
lot of States, which is going to mean you are going to have to 
get your news content from NewsGuard raters.
    Mr. BEAN. I will take it as a yes.
    Thank you, and I yield back, Mr. Chairman.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Gentleman yields back. I now 
Representative Maloy from the great State of Utah for 5 
minutes.
    Ms. MALOY. First of all, I just want to thank the witnesses 
for being here, and I apologize I have had to be in and out a 
couple of times. I testified in front of a committee once and I 
spent a lot of time preparing, and the Members came in and out 
and I found that kind of irritating, so I apologize, but that 
has been me today.
    I think I am going last, right, Mr. Chair? One more. Okay. 
So I don't have to----
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Do you want to go last?
    Ms. MALOY. No. I am good. I just wanted to know if I need 
to wrap it up or if I can build. Okay.
    I feel like I talk about the same things a lot in this 
committee, but what we are here talking about isn't necessarily 
what the First Amendment says, but what the proper roles of 
government agencies are. And this is the Small Business 
Committee, and the reason we are talking about it here and not 
in Oversight or Judiciary right now is because we have got 
government entities that are acting outside of their proper 
role, and it is having a negative impact on main street 
businesses in the United States of America, and that is 
something I think we should all find troubling, no matter where 
you fall on the political spectrum.
    And so, I do have questions, but I want to be clear when I 
start asking questions that that is where I am coming from. 
That is what we are talking about here, is what role the 
government should be playing in picking winners and losers in 
the free market.
    So Mr. Weingarten, I want to start with you, because you 
talked about something that I want to give you a little bit 
more time to follow up on. So we are talking about foreign 
facing--foreign facing agencies--easy for me to say--that are 
supposed to be giving ratings to disinformation coming from 
other nations, correct?
    Mr. WEINGARTEN. That is correct.
    Ms. MALOY. And now they are using those authorities to do 
what?
    Mr. WEINGARTEN. They are using those authorities 
effectively to attempt to cripple the business models of 
disfavored media companies, U.S.-based media companies 
included.
    Ms. MALOY. So we are not really talking about government 
speech and what is and isn't allowed. We are talking about 
these specific agencies have authorities and they are acting 
outside of those authorities. Am I understanding that 
correctly?
    Mr. WEINGARTEN. That is how I see it--and not to speak, but 
to suppress others' speech.
    Ms. MALOY. Yeah. And it is not just about saying what 
somebody can or can't say, but they give a rating, and based on 
that rating, somebody may or may not be able to get sponsors.
    Mr. WEINGARTEN. That is correct.
    Ms. MALOY. So as a politician, I know how hard it is to get 
your message out in front of people, and as a Member of 
Congress, I kind of have a naturally built-in platform. In 
fact, I am using it right now. But for a main street business, 
if they get a negative rating because of their conservative 
views, that can have a real impact on their ability to get 
their product in front of customers, not necessarily a 
government program or government policy, but we are talking 
about main street businesses struggling to get their products 
in front of people because they hold a view that is unpopular 
with the government agency. Am I off base here?
    Mr. WEINGARTEN. No. That is correct.
    Ms. MALOY. Okay. So I am most of the way through my time. I 
just want to, before I am done, give each of you three a 
chance. Is there anything you wanted to say today that no one's 
asked you the right question to get you to say?
    Ms. YOUNES. The First Amendment says that the government 
shall not abridge the freedom of speech, abridge. So the 
government should not be using its power to censor ideas, 
whether it is through coercion, collusion, any of those means. 
I think that is the most important principle that I want to put 
forth.
    Ms. MALOY. I agree. That is also how they taught it in my 
law school.
    Mr. WEINGARTEN. It is notable that in the opinion that came 
down today, there is a footnote in the majority's opinion which 
says ``Because we do not reach the merits, we express no view 
as to whether the Fifth Circuit correctly articulated the 
standard for when the Govern-ment transforms private conduct 
into State action.'' So it is not a ruling on the merits, but 
the Court's silence on the merits I think speaks to the 
imperative for legislative action to be taken, because the 
courts are not necessarily going to provide a panacea on this 
issue.
    Ms. MALOY. Yeah.
    Ms. Sheffield.
    Ms. SHEFFIELD. Yes. Being from Utah, great to connect with 
you. My ancestors helped found Salt Lake City.
    Ms. MALOY. Wonderful.
    Ms. SHEFFIELD. So I mentioned earlier in my remarks about 
the I think staggering ratio of eight-to-one when we are 
talking about State Department employees donating to Democrats 
by an eight-to-one margin versus Republicans. To me, this begs 
the question to what extent is the unelected bureaucracy of the 
politburo of the State Department and other government 
agencies, to what extent do these unelected bureaucrats shape 
what happens in terms of these funds and government taxpayer 
money for projects like the University of Cambridge Social 
Decision Making lab, the Moonshot CVE, the Atlantic Council 
Digital Forensic's research lab, who elected these bureaucrats 
at the State Department and other agencies to take my tax 
dollars, your tax dollars, the people--my cousins and uncles in 
Utah, their tax dollars to fund these suppressive activities? I 
think----
    Ms. MALOY. I don't know if you are allowed to question me, 
but the answer is nobody. And I am going to just cut you off so 
I can use the rest of my time to point out, since you brought 
up Salt Lake City, it was settled by people who were running 
from the government telling them they couldn't exercise their 
First Amendment rights, so this isn't the first time this has 
happened. It is important, and having this hearing is bedrock 
important to what we do as Americans.
    And with that, Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Lady yields back. I now recognize 
Representative Alford from the great State of Missouri for 5 
minutes.
    Mr. ALFORD. Thank you, Chair, and thank you for holding 
this all-important meeting, and thank you, Ranking Member 
Velazquez, as well. The First Amendment is at the heart of what 
makes this country great. The right, the freedom of speech, the 
prohibition on government infringement, is what separates our 
country from the rest of the world.
    However, the Biden administration does not agree with this. 
This administration has been using the power of the executive 
branch to infringe upon America's right to freedom of speech. 
While the First Amendment prevents direct government 
intervention, the administration has found a back door by 
finding and supporting so called disinformation organizations. 
There have been more than 500 U.S. federal government contracts 
or grants awarded on disinformation since 2020. This funding 
has been used to build a network of government-backed 
nonprofits, so called fact-checkers, organizations of 
foundations to push the left-wing narrative by declaring 
anything right of the New York Times is disinformation. They 
have been successful in doing this.
    As revealed in an email from a Meta executive to Mark 
Zuckerberg, quote, We are facing continued pressure from 
external stakeholders, including the White House, to remove 
more COVID-19 vaccine discouragement content.
    If the federal government is successful in moving companies 
as large as Meta with a market cap well over $1 trillion, what 
can they do to small businesses?
    I was in the news business for 35 years. My goal was to 
tell the truth. When we have organizations like this that are 
coming in and telling us what the truth is and limiting the 
truth from getting out, we are in a big world of hurt when it 
comes to the First Amendment.
    Ms. Younes, one of the most disturbing aspects of 
government-backed censorship was the State Department's support 
of the Global Disinformation Index, or GDI. The GDI's mission 
is to catalyze industry and government to defund 
disinformation. Can you please explain the legal basis upon 
which your clients brought the case against the State 
Department and its Global Engagement Center.
    Ms. YOUNES. There are three main claims. First of all, it 
is a First Amendment violation because by funding and working 
with the Global Disinformation Index, which is effectively 
blacklisting conservative news sites or disfavored news sites, 
the government is interfering in the marketplace of ideas, and 
effectively censoring our clients. There is--it has to go 
through a couple of levels. You have to--it is not direct. It 
is through these mechanisms. And that is what makes it kind of 
insidious and has been allowing them to get away with it.
    It is also a problem because the GEC is supposed to be 
fighting--their mandate is to fight foreign disinformation. 
They operate under the State Department, which is about foreign 
affairs. They are not supposed to be dealing with domestic 
speech and they don't even pretend.
    For instance, there was a presentation which you can look 
at online in which the GEC's technology and engagement 
representative Alexis Frisbie said that they were having 
conversations to ensure there is discussion occurring, so I 
think you know those are in terms of interaction. That is 
talking about it at domestic level. They are not even 
pretending this is about foreign disinformation anymore.
    Mr. ALFORD. Mr. Weingarten, NewsGuard is another left-wing 
organization supposedly ranking disinformation in the news. Let 
me tell you, just because you have news in your title doesn't 
mean you are a news organization, or you are fit to call what 
are balls and strikes in the news business. We have dealt with 
them on the Armed Services Committee. We are getting them out 
of the business of regulating speech for the DOD. It doesn't 
only decide which source of media are or not disinformation. 
They also have partnered with the largest teachers' union in 
the world to teach students about disinformation. What does 
NewsGuard's partnership with the American Federation of 
Teachers, a top donor to President Biden, mean for center right 
news?
    Mr. WEINGARTEN. I think it means that the American children 
are going to get a left-wing or left-wing-oriented diet of news 
content going forward to the extent the relationship persists, 
and what is called media literacy education increasingly gets 
mandated in States across the country.
    Mr. ALFORD. How much of a danger are organizations like 
NewsGuard to the foundations and principles of America?
    Mr. WEINGARTEN. I think they pose an existential threat. It 
would be illiberal for them to exist even if they weren't 
government funded, but the government funding makes it 
particularly chilling and disturbing.
    Mr. ALFORD. This is a very, very disturbing issue that we 
are dealing with in all realms of government right now in the 
committees on which we serve. This is of utmost importance, 
because if you cannot get information that is unfiltered and 
the truth to people, we are going to be brainwashed into a 
liberal woke, broke, ideal of what America truly is.
    Thank you, and I yield back.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Gentleman yields back, and I would like 
to thank our witnesses today for their testimony and for 
appearing before us today. We had some good testimony. Without 
objection, Members have 5 legislative days to submit additional 
materials and written questions of the witnesses to the Chair, 
which will be forwarded to the witnesses, so I ask the 
witnesses to please respond promptly if that happens. If there 
is no further opinions, without objection, the committee is 
adjourned.
    [Whereupon, at 12:05 p.m., the committee was adjourned.]
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